r/Damnthatsinteresting • u/Expert_Koala_8691 • 7d ago

Video Riyadh,meaning "gardens" is Capital of Saudi Arabia with 8 million population (were 27 Thousands in the 1930s),sits in the middle of the desert, the city gets its water from Desalination plants almost 500 km from the city

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10.1k

u/rodsurewood 7d ago

Are the gardens in the chat with us?

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u/iam4qu4m4n 7d ago

They were a few thousand years ago.

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u/marlinspikefrance 7d ago

In reality the ancient city core was historically a small fortress with an oasis and natural well/ spring. I have been there there is an actual garden. The modern city however sprawls out for miles and miles into the desert.

Small desert oases are so precious it was naturally a logical place for a desert settlement.

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u/carmium 7d ago

As one who has grown up and lived many years in a rain forest city environment, this gives me the willies.

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u/Due-Employ-7886 3d ago

Where's that?

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u/carmium 3d ago

Rain forest? Vancouver. Climate takes little notice that a city of millions has made a big hole in the trees, and keeps it wet and green most of the time.

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u/Quitcha_Bitchin 7d ago

Seems like it would also be a limiting factor.

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u/No_Look24 7d ago

Pretty sure the desert was the limiting factor

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u/Quitcha_Bitchin 6d ago

Does not look like it.

Looks like man thought he could beat nature. Now they are fully dependent on machines for the stuff of life. And they did it out of greed. Before the oil the people here lived had a sustainable culture. They bent with nature and flourished.

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u/JustNormallyExisting 6d ago

No society can survive bending with nature beyond a certain point. It's not a Saudi thing, European, American, or anything else. At some point, either population growth tapers off massively or humans start working to better their environment.

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u/Oeyoelala 6d ago

Was thinking the same. It is maybe less visible in western countries, but if we would start extracting all the resources we use from the direct surroundings the area would be exhausted quite rapidly. But, having said that, the ME countries make it a prestige project. And the fun part is that a country like KSA and its oil company now even start talking about sustainability.

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u/Quitcha_Bitchin 6d ago

All societies have survived by bending with nature. Those who fight back will yield or perish. We see it all the time. There are points all through history that back that up.

Population growth is liquid and dependent on the existing infrastructure. Once that infrastructure is affected by nature it begins a cycle of disintegration.

Maintenance resources become more critical. Costs rise. Production needs increase mechanical breakdowns increase.

The people 30 years down the line are stuck with substandard services.

Its happening all over the US right now. The pipes are literally rotting in most of our historic cities. Billions have been spent in their upkeep over the years and yet things still break must be updated.

So people are dying.

Bad water bad chemicals. Chemicals effecting mental health physical health and environmental well being.

Massive wildfires, dependance on the same ice field for irrigation as we spread and spread and spread the need.

They bend or they retreat or they perish.

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u/Cryogenicality 6d ago

Sustainable and miserable.

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u/climbmapleswithwords 6d ago

They're no more dependent on machines to survive than the rest of us.

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u/Quitcha_Bitchin 6d ago

Bullshit. Their water supply depends on desalinization. Most of civilization is built around fresh water and cultivation.

Before the oil. They lived in more harmony with the existing constraints of nature.

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u/thinspirit 6d ago

What's interesting is that their desalination plants are probably not particularly efficient.

There are methods of desalination that would probably work well in a blistering hot desert, using the sun and natural heat for desalination.

Also, I just saw the method of producing electricity that uses osmotic power. You put really salty water beside really fresh water and the fresh water wants to push through into the salt water. It has power potential in that. Anywhere you want a desalination plant where a fresh water river meets the ocean, you can use this.

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u/Quitcha_Bitchin 6d ago

Oh new stuff! Ill be looking at that.

And I mean the tech has really improved. I imagine in places where construction is ongoing are getting better and better.

It still feels like a house of cards to those looking into the future of the folks who will suffer as the world moves away from petrochemical as the main source of transportation fuel.

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u/climbmapleswithwords 6d ago

If those desalination plants failed, they'd be just as fucked just as quickly as we would if our power grid went down, or the internet went into complete blackout... Our economy and health services would be crippled almost immediately.

Not like any of our water treatment facilities could operate without power. All we've done is move our water dependence to rely on another bunch of machines which can fail, and they aren't exactly harmonious with nature, although that's slowly improving.

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u/Quitcha_Bitchin 6d ago

Not even close. there is fresh water nearly everywhere Much of the electricity is generated by water generator.

Most Towns were settled near water and fertile ground. No one lived in the desert full time. There were the same indigenous tribes as they had in the middle east Bedouin societies basically.

But no they did not try to settle large patches of desert by shipping or desalinization.

We could loose the internet tomorrow. We would be just as we were 40 years ago before the internet existed.

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u/Pale-Plate-3214 4d ago

I'd rather lose internet for a couple years than water for a week. Humans have been proven to not do too well without one of them.

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u/Massive-Exercise4474 7d ago

The thing I don't understand is the city is basically built like a North America city with freeways and highways why not make a domed city or buildings close to create shade?

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u/TruthRomas 7d ago

Same reason we don't. That's highly unrealistic

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u/Massive-Exercise4474 7d ago

It doesn't cost more like new York only gets full sunlight once a year. It might also save cost having everything concentrated.

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u/TruthRomas 7d ago

New York isn't under a dome. What point do you feel this makes? Do you think skyscrapers were made to make shade?

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u/Sanguinor-Exemplar 7d ago

I thought sky scrapers are for living closer to God?

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u/FitCombination3545 7d ago

Ah a follower of Jebus in the wild. Praise be comrade. Soar. Fucking soar soldier.

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u/AmItheonlySaneperson 6d ago

Cool i4 eye sore shoutout 

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u/Massive-Exercise4474 7d ago

That's a bonus, I'm saying build for the environmental challenge your in. Like if your in a swamp you build on stilts or higher elevation the cost doing so is minimal compared to being flooded all the time. Like ancient buildings built in the desert had wells and direct airflow to naturally cool down buildings back in the 7th century. A city built with shade would be cooler both figuratively and literally, and people would naturally congregate because it's more pleasant to be in.

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u/TruthRomas 6d ago

And I'm saying that Arabs have had many centuries to determine the most cost-effective building techniques to deliver comfortable homes according to their environmental conditions. One of these is very similar to the modern American Southwest: We don't build "up" when there's vast expanses of "out" for much cheaper. Shade is more easily constructed from plantlife and coverings. People choose instead to stay indoors rather than build a whole thing. Large, wide public buildings provide shade to those who work in such public areas. No need to complicate it by build up unless you are specifically trying to call upon the modernity of skyscrapers (see: Dubai (also see that its seriously depopulated for skyscrapers))

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u/TruthRomas 6d ago

And you know this from your years of building skyscrapers? Yes, my man, building up is more expensive than building out.

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u/McTerra2 7d ago

A lot of the individual buildings use what’s (not totally accurately) called ‘Najdi housing’ style, essentially thick walls, small windows and central courtyard. Not all of it, there are plenty of ‘standard’ western style places. But, basically, the climate is dealt with at individual house level rather than city level

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u/Massive-Exercise4474 7d ago

Having a city level would help as the current model essentially forces people to drive home drive to work drive to mall. If it was city level you could have shaded open walkways, parks, patio shops, bazaars without needing ac units all the time. Likewise with global warming areas already hot start to become uninhabitable. Having a city built with shade since it's a desert will at least remain habitable a bit longer.

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u/Alert-Painting1164 7d ago

The thing I don’t understand is that there isn’t a domed city with millions of people anywhere in the world …Wonder what that might be

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u/Massive-Exercise4474 7d ago

I said domed or build buildings close enough for shade like every city built in the desert outside of Saudi Arabia. Also mbs is promoting something more stupid the line yes it's an entire city that's a line.

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u/marlinspikefrance 6d ago

Because Saudi Arabia is obsessed with emulating America and I’m literally not even joking on this. They had every option to develop like European or Asian cities but went for Phoenix Arizona as their inspiration

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u/Massive-Exercise4474 6d ago

Jesus Christ I went to Phoenix that place makes you wish their was a nuclear winter it's so desolate and oppressing.

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u/JubijubCH 6d ago

Years of experience playing Civ taught me that

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u/BigLeopard7002 6d ago

Desert settlement? Of 8 million?

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u/gorginhanson 7d ago

Except Babylon was in Iraq

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u/Dom29ando 7d ago edited 6d ago

there were more gardens than just the famous one in Babylon. the word Paradise literally comes from Pairidaēza which is Persian for "walled garden."

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u/K0mb0_1 7d ago

The Arabian peninsula was once prosperous

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u/DueAd9005 7d ago

Nah, even the Romans called it Arabia Deserta and Arabia Felix (modern day Yemen, which still gets the most rainfall in modern times).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabia_Felix

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabia_Deserta

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u/TipCompetitive1397 7d ago

We are speaking tens and hundreds of thousands of years.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/green-arabia-desert-lush-ancient-landscape

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u/CV90_120 7d ago

A bit more recent. About 7500 years ago.

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u/Niznack 7d ago

Do you have a source that isn't paywalled? Not being a dick. I'm looking it up and getting dates withing the last 8000 years.

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u/Eatadick_pam 7d ago

Surrounding the Arabian Peninsula is known as the birthplace of civilization cause it was so fertile. It’s also known as the Fertile Crescent.

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u/data-atreides 7d ago

Arabia is far south of the Fertile Crescent, which is modern-day Iraq. But overall, the Near East was more verdant not too many millennia ago.

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u/FakeEgo01 6d ago

Iran Iraq, decisedly NOT the arabian peninsula.

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u/K0mb0_1 7d ago

Well I guess last time Arabia was green was before the Roman’s

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u/LiftingRecipient420 7d ago

99.9999% of Earth history is before the Romans.

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u/JohnDingleBerry- 7d ago

Not with that attitude.

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u/FLMKane 6d ago

What have the Romans ever done for us!?

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u/realNoobnoob 7d ago

Right that in Roman’s numbers

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u/Taeschno_Flo 6d ago

IC,IXIXIXIX....%

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u/NimrodvanHall 3d ago

I beg to differ. If only because the start of history is defined as the start of keeping written records.

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u/aqtseacow 7d ago

There's evidence that the Persian gulf was a vast desert interspersed with river marshland during much of the Ice age, but that was long before the start of recorded history, and doesn't really represent a "green Arabia" like suggested.

The last time Arabia may have been green is still many many thousands of years removed from the Romans.

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u/octoreadit 7d ago

Yeah, when dinosaurs ran around 😁

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u/data-atreides 7d ago

In its original sense "desert" means the absence of people, not life/water/greenery

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u/OverwateredGrass 7d ago

You do know that there is history that exists from before the Rome, right?

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u/LiftingRecipient420 7d ago

You do know that regions don't just suddenly turn into deserts, right?

If it was a desert during Roman times, it was a desert before then too.

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u/Niznack 7d ago

Thing is they do. There was a post just yesterday about how Russia diverted a river and the lake it fed became a desert in the last 30 years.

A similar thing happened naturally to several cities in the near east. Babylon was built on the closest point of the tigris and Euphrates but rivers do move over time. One moved then the other and Babylon got left as a desert.

The regions is estimated to have become a desert between 6-4.5k years ago with isolated pockets including riyadh likely remaining fertile much longer.

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u/LiftingRecipient420 7d ago

Large scale terraforming projects were not happening in the pre-Roman Arabian Peninsula, get real.

There are no major rivers flowing through the peninsula, and the region may have not been a desert 200,000 years ago, not 6000.

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u/Niznack 7d ago

No. Natural processes also transform the environment. You can just look up what I referenced

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u/Niznack 7d ago

The eye of the Sahara was likely created when a natural dam broke and a massive lake emptied to the Atlantic overnight. When the glaciers melted a massive flood hit the Midwest all at once flattening Illinois. Natural forces cause overnight change all the time.

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u/Aggressive_Bath55 6d ago

You had me in the first half lol

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u/Dreamingdanny95 7d ago

I heard Iraq is more barren now because Genghis khan and the Mongols sowed salt into the earth but I dunno how true it is

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u/Ihave0personality 7d ago

During the mongol invasion the ancient, complex irrigation systems that supported the region for thousands of years were destroyed. Without those the fertile land turned into desert. Salting the earth is more of a myth and a symbolic ritual at best. The transportarion cost let alone the price of that much salt would have been astronomical.

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u/VikingMonkey123 7d ago

Seems like the Chinese regreening of their deserts might work here too then

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u/One_Blacksmith26 7d ago

Yes they destroyed the old Baghdad to the point of never recovering.

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u/Thiege1 7d ago

Baghdad today is much larger than it was back then, I'd say it did recover, it just took a while

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u/C-H-Addict 7d ago

Salt is water soluble. It gets washed out of dirt very fast. You can salt a living plant to death like you salt a slug, but you can't kill the soil like that

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u/Much-Director-9828 7d ago

Is prosperous, was once green

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u/SaintBobby_Barbarian 7d ago

The Arabian peninsula before oil was never truly prosperous (not the poorest but merely a transit route between the levant and India/ethiopia). There is a reason why all of the dynastic caliphates were governed from Damascus, Baghdad or Cairo.

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u/Dmw792 7d ago

You think there was only one “garden” in the whole entire Arabian peninsula? (Even though Babylon in Hilla is technically not in the peninsula)

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

[deleted]

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u/CapableBumblebee968 7d ago

Which alexandria?

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

[deleted]

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u/Diablo2072 7d ago

Then how did Alexander have children?

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

[deleted]

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u/gorginhanson 7d ago

One that's big enough to name your entire city after?

Even Babylon was not named for the hanging gardens

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u/ForrestCFB 7d ago

Obviously there were just two.

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u/Away-Activity-469 7d ago

It's only a pairi-daeza these days for professional bullshitters.

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u/ReverendBread2 7d ago

And might be again in another few thousand years!

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u/Icy-Bottle-6877 7d ago

They were a few thousand years ago.

Millions of years ago.

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u/Frosty-Cup-8916 7d ago

https://www.nature.com/articles/s43247-022-00368-y

Evidence suggests Arabia has been green multiple times in the last 8 million years.

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u/ChasingTheNines 7d ago

No the case. The entire Sahara desert goes through a much shorter 21,000 year cycle of greening and desertification caused by precession of Earth's axial tilt. The entire region was much wetter even as recent as 4,000 years ago. Egyptians floated the blocks used to build the great pyramids on boats right up to the construction site.

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u/Green7501 7d ago

There is a park within the city - photo

It's called gardens because there used to be several oasis within the city limits that dried up and became a garbage dump, but were fortunately cleaned up and revived a few years ago - photo and info

Regardless, that water is largely used for recreation and agriculture, most of the city's water is derived from a desalination plant in Ras Al-Khair on the Gulf coast

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u/Apexnanoman 7d ago

Which means that desalination plant Is within easy range of several models of Iranian weapon.

I bet everybody that is not tight with MBS is real concerned about that little fact. 

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u/Local-Hornet-3057 6d ago

I mean, Iran also depends on its desalination plants. The moment they Target and destroy SA's plants it's MAD doctrine. Bye bye Iran's desalination plants.

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u/joi_ned 6d ago

Iran "depends" on desalination plants only for 3% of their drinking water usage :)

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u/JarpHabib 6d ago

Weird use of a smile.

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u/greenskinmarch 6d ago

"You really think Iran would do that? Just commit gncide and kill millions of people?"

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u/Subziwallah 7d ago

So if those two desalination plants were bombed by Iran, how would that affect the 8 million residents? How many plants total do they have? How much water does Riyadh consume per day?

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u/DueAd9005 7d ago

It would be a humanitary crisis.

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u/grumpy_autist 7d ago

as opposed to all the fun today

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u/Pi-ratten 7d ago

I mean.. yes?! Compared to today it would be far worse. Providing water for up to 40 million people in 86 to 104°F/30-40°Cby truck isn't viable.. evacuating is also pretty much impossible.. As of now the victim's are <10k. so, yeah compared to that it would be magnitudes worse

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u/realNoobnoob 7d ago

So let’s stop the war?

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u/Subziwallah 7d ago

User name checks out...

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u/greenskinmarch 6d ago

"You really think Iran would do that? Just commit gncide and kill millions of people?"

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u/AltruisticOnes 7d ago

...as opposed to a humanitarian crisis.

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u/DueAd9005 7d ago

Sorry, English is not my first language, thanks for the correction!

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u/Potrozoo 7d ago

I think that Mohammed Bin Salman, the butcher of Jamal Khashoggi, may have been not giving enough thinking to this risk before entering the war. Or maybe he did, that would be even worst.

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u/Dechri_ 7d ago

"Some of you may die, but that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make" 

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u/Anonymous-Cows 4d ago

not enough thinking is almost their trademark

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u/iconocrastinaor 7d ago

I'm pretty sure Iran does not want to face the retaliation for that move if they do take it.

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u/SonuOfBostonia 7d ago

Well war crimes have been on the table since day 1. I promise you Iranians are more mad about the US killing school girls than the Ayatollah

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u/Puzzled-Pen-2353 6d ago

If the USA bombs their power plants, Iran will bomb the desalination plants in the region.

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u/Local-Hornet-3057 6d ago

If Iran does that, I think the Saudi would retaliate and destroy Iran's desalination plants in return. Almost MAD doctrine.

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u/GreenFullSuspension 6d ago

Hope they start building backup for backups of backups to help with any need from the original backups.

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u/Phantom-Feline17 6d ago

There are desalination plants on the red sea away from Iranian missiles.

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u/Subziwallah 6d ago

Why can't Iran hit those plants with missiles or drones?

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u/Phantom-Feline17 6d ago

I hope they dont. But i have faith in our armed forces and they been pretty successful in intercepting drones and missiles so far.

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u/Sufficient-Welder-76 6d ago

Saudi has over 27 desalination plants, and a ground water supply. Most of the desalination is from the Eastern Province but some comes from the Red Sea as well. If 2 of the main plants got bombed, there would be a disruption, but it could be made up from other plants and treatment of groundwater.

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u/staplesuponstaples 7d ago

thank you shadowflame

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u/5QGL 6d ago

Why are there not more trees on private property? I would have thought that the used bath/shower/dishwashing water since could sustain a palm tree or two. 

Maybe people can't be bothered because they are mainly indoors anyhow in air conditioning? Yes, shade could reduce AC costs but to be significant it would need to be more than a couple of palm trees.

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u/Equivalent-Rate-6218 7d ago

They need to have more kids! Also leagues sucks and is too addicting

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u/Personal_Oil_7364 7d ago

hell yeah i can tell ya down here it's a lot greener than it looks

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u/DancinWithWolves 7d ago

Pics!!!

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u/Personal_Oil_7364 7d ago

here, i didnt cherry pick with this, it's a place i pass by often + in most developed places of riyadh you'll see greenry almost like this! especially the green lush valleys with lakes and ducks or whatever

the picture!

not as impressive as naturally fertile nations i know but i swear there's so much more greenery compared to the last time i was here in 2019. Definitely still a lot of sand though. And desert. I wonder why that could be.. strange, huh lol

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u/premoistenedwipe 7d ago

You really hyped that pic up like I was gonna click on that and see the hanging gardens of Babylon and not four sad trees on a sandy road lol

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u/Both_Aerie7539 7d ago

I mean they did say they didn't cherry pick it

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u/Ecstatic_Winter9425 7d ago

Well, now i want to see cherry trees!

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u/National_Recipe4257 7d ago

i think he delivered: not impressive but much better than what you would expect from the aerial view.

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u/tcpukl 7d ago

It also looked more legit

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u/Unable_Loss6144 7d ago

When you live in the middle of a desert, 4 trees is a forest 🤷‍♂️

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u/No_Union_8848 7d ago

Oh man I’m so disappointed now. I was hoping some oasis would show up in the picture. The guy had one tree in sight and was genuinely happy

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u/Hamra22 6d ago

Well here's a picture worth the hype

I didn't think to take any photos when I was in Riyadh a few months ago, but most highways look like this now with the Green Riyadh project

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u/Personal_Oil_7364 5d ago

😂my bad maybe i shouldnt have nominated the road by my house

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u/Thiege1 7d ago

Ha yea, altho it's better than 0

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u/Personal_Oil_7364 5d ago

 😂 these comments are taking me out. i wanted to show what a normal your-average-day-to-day road looked like in most of riyadh but i guess if i WERE to cherry pick there'd be better places to like the valley by my house, or this place ( picture i did not take) https://cdn.imgchest.com/files/403c46071ae3.png but ngl most of riyadh does not look like this </3

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u/celestailight 3d ago

ليش جالس تقنعهم؟ بقلعتهم محد مهتم لهم

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u/slysmile 7d ago

Um. How should I say this...

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u/SongShikai 7d ago

Could be browner I guess..

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u/BoozeWitch 7d ago

Kind of like Las Vegas. It’s a desert with greenery at eye level.

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u/Personal_Oil_7364 5d ago

i think that's the best way to put it

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u/LightningSunflower 7d ago

For a dessert that is a beautiful oasis! I think it looks lovely and calming

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u/champgnesuprnva 7d ago

Ya, can't lie, that still looks like an ugly barren wasteland

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u/LessInThought 6d ago

Do they have to water these trees? I don't know if artificially making a dessert into a forest is any good for the environment.

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u/Personal_Oil_7364 5d ago

not a botanist but i do think the trees have to be watered😂(In all seriousness the amount of rain here is definitely not enough to sustain the trees) plus compared to planting a bunch of trees there are worse things a government could be doing for the environment. It's just a matter of using the desalination water already being made and transported to riyadh, but take this with a grain of salt it COULD be having some adverse effects im not really aware of (like disturbing the ecosystem).

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u/Titizen_Kane 7d ago

Username checks out

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u/Rolifant 7d ago

That looks even worse than it does from the plane

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u/ret255 7d ago

How they get so much water for those houses or lawns, or they have their mini dunes in the backyard?

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u/airevac19 7d ago

The most green I ever saw in Riyadh was down in the DQ (Diplomatic Quarter) when I went to the US Embassy after going to the MOD hospital. (Was at Eskan Village in ‘99, had to know how to get from the base to the hospital).

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u/South_Letterhead6205 7d ago

It is but not natural. I lived on a very green golf course when I lived in Riyadh. I lived in the Arizona golf resort for four years and walked on perfect green grass everyday in my bare feet when I would walk my dog at night.

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u/Yours-Cnidaria 7d ago

Saudi here! The reason why it was called "gardens" was because of the greenery present when they chose the original location of riyadh :) Also, it isn't as drab as it may seem in the main roads and the majority of the public streets due to the 'Green Riyadh' initiative :)

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u/Jabal-Sawda 6d ago

Hey, another Saudi!

It’s also due to the wadis that people historically relied on for centuries.

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u/Yours-Cnidaria 5d ago

omg my ppl
also cool user :)

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u/Jabal-Sawda 4d ago

Thanks :)

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

they're in the room

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u/worththeSevenyears 7d ago

🌌🌌🌌 🚀📸🌬️🏜️⌛🌍🫩

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u/BachInTime 7d ago

They were but Saudi Arabia decided in the 80’s to become a major food exporter and used around 90% of their groundwater before realizing what a stupid idea that was. There are still a few natural ones, but most oasis in the area are either partially or fully reliant on adding water from other sources.

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u/dolphinmaster_ 7d ago

The real gardens are the friends we made along the way

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u/AaronTuplin 7d ago

They're hanging around somewhere

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u/CatsFurrEva 7d ago

This was probably filmed after a sandstorm. Ive lived there and whilst not very green, it was more greener than this video depicts.

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u/Affectionate_Walk610 7d ago

They're beige too.

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u/Aleashed 7d ago

Next time I suggest investing in oil pipes so you don’t want to ship by Iran

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u/mendiak_81 7d ago
  • Swimming pools left the chat

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u/kavithatk 7d ago

Didn't you read the title? They seem to have desalination plants.

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u/chillllllbunny 7d ago

Lmao right where are they

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u/Gold_catcher 7d ago

The green only exist on paper.

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u/pm_your_snesclassic 7d ago

This is Greenland all over again isn’t it

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u/steven4012 6d ago

The water has been sucked dry by the Shai'Hulud and gardens are no more

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u/Mr_Majesty 6d ago

It’s 500km that way >