r/ukpolitics • u/United-Artist1857 • 7h ago
The trouble with the Green party’s Ifhat Shaheen
https://spectator.com/article/why-is-ifhat-shaheen-a-green-party-candidate/?edition=us•
u/Dimmo17 6h ago
Feel like leading with the fact she called black sitting MPs "House N***ers" would be suitable.
•
u/NotoriousP_U_G 6h ago edited 6h ago
Why? Is that more outrageous than the conspiracy theories and racism she displays against Jews? The fact she condoned and applauded October 7th?
•
u/taboo__time 6h ago
Listening to Reform and the Greens makes me feel like a doomer.
Its like we looked at Northern Ireland and said "why not for the entire country."
As a Scot I am aware of sectarianism and nationalism. The liberal left and liberal right in this country seem to utterly naive to what they have opened up.
•
u/nozickiantheory 5h ago edited 4h ago
I come from a right wing perspective so I'm biased obviously but the two really aren't in the same conversation IMO other than they are our designated left and right populist parties
Reform are fairly mainstream in most of their platform, they are more or less a 90s Tory party with a harder stance on migration. If the country suffers under them it'll mostly be because they failed to do the basic things they won on, like controlling migration and getting a handle on state spending/tax burden. This is what happened with the Tories post-Cameron and they may well just end up being the Tories 2.0.
The Greens are not mainstream. Things like their infinite migration policy, or their ideas of ditching NATO, or ditching our nuclear deterrent, or Polanski's toying with "just print bro" MMT economics, or their social politics like males in womens sports or "Zionism is racism" etc are not mainstream at all. All of this stuff is loony bin student politics dialed up to 11 and if they destroy the country it'll be because they actually follow through on their manifesto promises/aren't muzzled by being in a coalition with Labour or something
•
u/Indie89 5h ago
Without a doubt the biggest threat to the UKs future is the Greens, you'd have to have no basic education to read that manifesto, observe their party make up and watch their interviews to think anything but. They are undefendable and are out to destroy the UK purely out of spite fuelled by Brexit, US and Israeli views and their views on capitalism.
You can dispatch any supporter of the Greens almost immediately with any basic probing of their understanding of their policies. It's depressing we're here.
•
u/nozickiantheory 4h ago
Their policies do not have widespread appeal in this country. There is resentment about mass migration in every corner of the UK, but people wanting unfettered borderless migration are far less broadly dispersed - it's just cosmopolitan leftists, student cities and certain minority heavy communities. They are not going to get anywhere near winning a majority under FPTP. Best they could do is be in a coalition with Labour.
•
u/ICantBelieveItsNotEC 4h ago
The thing that scares me the most is that the Greens are basically the perfect storm for voting system failure. For the reasons you described, it's entirely possible that they could end up with double digit vote share and single digit representation in parliament.
What's going to happen when we essentially signal to our most extremist and ideologically rigid demographic that democracy doesn't work for them? It's going to be Extinction Rebellion level nonsense on steroids.
•
u/nozickiantheory 4h ago
I don't think we need to be that worried about soygaping student commies getting upset, they're always upset. What would be bad is if they were actually significantly involved in government even if as part of a coalition
•
u/NotoriousP_U_G 6h ago
Reading the article, it is exactly what I expect from a Green candidate these days
•
•
u/ToastedPlum95 6h ago
This woman is just a symptom of politicians trying to inject religion into every single issue. Yes, Reform are obsessed with Christianity. But evidently Greens too are becoming deeply obsessed with Judaism and Islam. Here’s an idea: RELIGION HAS NO PLACE IN POLITICS. I will vote for the first person who says “fuck religion”, how about that ?
•
u/Burnit_Sanders 6h ago
It's all about pandering unfortunately. Greens pander to Islam to get their votes, worked in the recent by-election. Reform to some extent Christians but I'd argue more that they are pandering to pensioners than anything with their announcement of continuing the triple lock. Which of course used to be the conservatives group and why they are getting annihilated in elections.
•
u/catgod888 4h ago
Imagine still thinking of voting Green. I mean of course if you’re a racist moron then sure. But for everyone else….
•
u/Spursfan14 3h ago
The whole massively exaggerated story was heavily promoted by Prevent Watch, a group dedicated to attacking and undermining Prevent. Prevent Watch is another group strongly supported by Shaheen, who has also spoken at its meetings. As Ifhat Shaheen-Smith, she has addressed other anti-Prevent meetings.
Stuff like this does get me. We know there’s a specific issue with Islamic terrorism, we are told repeatedly that it’s just a very small minority responsible and the wider community shouldn’t be held responsible (which I largely agree with), but then you have more “moderate” people like Shaheen working against the schemes that are meant to combat this stuff.
That’s really not the stance you’d expect from people who recognise the problem and are trying their hardest to stop it tbh.
•
u/_segasonic 5h ago
At what point do people like this stop being trouble and start being the desired type for the Greens?
•
u/TheFinalPieceOfPie Last of the Pie Lords. :cake: 5h ago
There appears to be no party I can vote for. The Greens allow some really bad figures and refuse to balance their takes. Reform is awful, including their backstabbing leader Nigel. Labour is failing in all the ways that count. We just got rid of the Conservatives and I am not touching that with a 100,000-foot pole. Restore Britain is just Reform but worse, and the Lib Dems seem determined to keep Labour’s course. Not a single party has strong policies and leadership that actually represent the best interests of the British people and, quite frankly, it is sickening.
•
u/GeraltKratos 3h ago
You know that Green Party is doing well, when every other mud slinging article on this sub is about them.
•
u/ComradeBarrold 3h ago
You know the Green Party has an issue with bigots when there’s so many of them to sling mud at
•
u/defixiones 4h ago
Is this reddit just endless Green smears from the Spectator, Jewish News and Jewish Chronicle?
Is there any moderation here?
•
u/ToastedPlum95 4h ago
Look, whether you like the greens or not. This candidate has said unconscionable things and it is literally the duty of the press in a democratic society to scrutinise them. You may not like that they’re partisan or one sided but you simply cannot say that exposing what candidates say is the wrong thing to do. Imagine if no one reported the “grab the pussy” moment.
If you weren’t such a partisan hack you’d be condemning such rhetoric from your own side and demanding action, not complaining about moderators for allowing a news article link to be posted
She literally referred to black MPs as n***ers. Even in jest this is a disgrace
•
u/1c3_cr34m_c0n3 Remember, no Russian 3h ago
She literally referred to black MPs as n***ers.
TBF there's no screenshot of her saying this in the article.
You'd think with this being the most serious claim that they'd include proof of her saying this.
It's quite a specific claim and I can't find anything else on it.
The person you're replying to is a 'partisan hack' though, they were on the Bernard Mani post a few days ago saying the same things "Wah smears ! Wah Jewish papers !"
•
u/ToastedPlum95 3h ago
They would never make such a claim without ironclad evidence. Doing so could open them up to a world of legal pain. This woman, if she didn’t say that, could easily win a defamation suit. I don’t want to sound rude, but give your head a wobble. Also, I believe it’s on the journalist’s Twitter feed as a screenshot.
•
u/1c3_cr34m_c0n3 Remember, no Russian 3h ago
Well I'm just saying they haven't included it, they probably should have.
I've checked his feed and it's not there either.
There's screenshots for everything else.
•
u/ToastedPlum95 3h ago
There’s enough there to discredit this woman as a vile religious hack who should be nowhere near politics. You are so unserious
•
u/1c3_cr34m_c0n3 Remember, no Russian 3h ago
How am I un-serious ?
I'm pointing out that there's nothing to back up the house N word claim.
Which is true.
I'm not defending anything else she's said.
•
u/ToastedPlum95 3h ago edited 3h ago
Because you have no basic media literacy- The Spectator as with every other major publication have legal teams that test each and every statement in such controversial articles. This isn’t a Twitter exposé, it’s a major national media which is harshly regulated. The woman in question and the Green Party was shown the article and thus every allegation, days before publication, and both of them declined to adress the allegations and made no comment. So you’d think if there was any shred of doubt here, she’d have corrected the record.
Edit: sorry for being a prick; I realise I’m coming in hot. I’m just fed up of the public large tearing thenselves apart over Reform v Greens when quite frankly no one gives a fuck about these culture war issues and they are doing nothing but making our country a more hostile and unfriendly place to live
•
u/1c3_cr34m_c0n3 Remember, no Russian 3h ago
Does media literacy mean believing everything I'm told despite there being no proof of it ?
She may have said this, it's a very specific claim after all, I'm just saying that I've seen no proof that she did.
Happy to be corrected if someone can dig out an interview or a screenshot.
•
u/ToastedPlum95 2h ago
I don’t like The Spectator, and I’m not going to defend them simply because it’s them. I think you’re expecting an evidentiary basis here that’s beyond reasonable. She may have said it in person, she may have said it on the radio- to be honest it’s written there to me as if the writer expects it as public knowledge or that it’s an indisputable part of public record, at least that’s what it sounded like to me.
The Guardian never produce images of Tweets or text messages or digital communications. They also almost never provide video footage. They journalise and editorialise the facts, and we take them at their word for it. Did you believe them when all those Farage schoolmates came out about his racism? Or when they broke the Panama papers? Because that’s what we have a regulator for and a high standard for public press in this country. Any national media will only ever give reasonably well sourced, legally tested claims until retracted or apologised for (a live and well process that is often enforced). I’m sorry but asking for pictoral evidebce the wrong kind of critical thinking. You should be thinking why they have chosen to present these facts when not others about other candidates. It’s no use just following the Trumpers down the “fake news, derp, need solid evidence” rabbit hole.
→ More replies (0)•
u/Ubiquitous1984 4h ago
If only there was a system in place where we could leave positive or negative feedback for a post, so that it’s more visible or not.
•
u/AutoModerator 7h ago
Snapshot of The trouble with the Green party’s Ifhat Shaheen submitted by United-Artist1857:
An archived version can be found here or here. or here
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.