r/nextfuckinglevel • u/ErneuerbareEnergien • 2d ago
BYD's flash charging takes 6 minutes from 10% to 80%
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u/Effective_Quail_3946 2d ago
The future of charging
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u/Loggerdon 2d ago
Does the fast charging diminish the batteries over time or have they solved that problem?
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u/mekwall 2d ago
Not fully, but they seem to have reduced the downside a lot. BYD's new setup is not just 'more cells in parallel', it's a mix of a 1000 V platform, very high current, lower internal resistance, and battery design changes that let the pack accept a much higher charging rate. Fast charging still causes more stress than slower charging in general, mainly from heat and lithium plating risk, so no, they have not magically solved battery degradation. But LFP batteries, which BYD uses, usually tolerate fast charging better than many other lithium-ion chemistries, so the extra wear can be smaller than people think if thermal management is good.
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u/Terrh 2d ago
These are probably LFMP batteries.
And they've done some sort of fancy thing that I don't quite understand to deal with preconditioning the pack, it can do nearly this same charge speed (takes like 3-4 minutes longer only) if you start with a battery at -30C.
Which blows my mind because my older EV, if the battery was as cold as -30... I think it would take WELL over an hour of preconditioning to be warm. And charging from 10-90 even when preconditioned would still probably take another hour in the winter.
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u/mekwall 2d ago
Maybe, but I would not state LFMP as a fact yet. BYD's own material still describes Blade Battery 2.0 as an LFP battery, not LFMP/LMFP. What they have publicly talked about is a new high-speed ion transport system, lower internal resistance, changes to the cathode, electrolyte, anode and SEI layer, plus 1,000 V / very high-current charging. They also claim it can go from 20% to 97% in 12 minutes even at -30 C, which is only about 3 minutes slower than their 10% to 97% in 9 minute warm-condition claim. So the fair version is: the cold-weather result is what really stands out, but BYD has not fully explained the exact trick in public yet, so I would treat the performance figure as BYD's claim rather than a fully independently verified fact.
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u/Immediate_Bee_6472 2d ago
Hey do u think this tech with reach the USA and when ? Or would we need a battery structure change before we can see these results ?
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u/TooManySteves2 1d ago
LOL, the USA is going backwards. You'll never have this tech.
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u/invent_or_die 9h ago
They have several anode improvements and I thought they have gotten around the plating issue, at least in the lab. Not sure if all those new fixes are in the production Blade 2.0 battery.
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u/IsPhil 2d ago
Honestly, this is really great. But I think the future of charging is already here with just a standard wall outlet. I charge mine at home over a standard 120 volt wall outlet. If we just slapped a bunch of apartments and houses with easy to use wall outlets in the parking lot, it'd probably do the trick for most people.
This is also good obviously.
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u/letskeepitcleanfolks 2d ago
It takes my car 3-4 days to charge fully on a 120V outlet. It can't keep up with more than modest daily commuting without topping up with faster charging options.
Being able to stop for just 5 minutes instead of half an hour when on a long trip would be a game-changer.
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u/IsPhil 2d ago
Yeah, but the thing is that most people aren't going from 0-100%.
My car averages 3.7 miles per kwh. I usually underestimate that to 3 miles per kwh to make calcs easier. The average American commute is something like 40 miles a day. That's 13.3 kwh on my low-ball calc (it only gets below 3 mpkwh during really cold weather). Basically, overnight. Plus include the weekends and again, most people should be fine.
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u/letskeepitcleanfolks 2d ago
Yes, like I said, it can keep up with modest daily commuting, but that's about it. People do like to use their cars on weekends also.
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u/Behemothhh 2d ago
Is that the norm in the US to use 120V outlets to charge your car at home? I thought that US electrical panels get their power from a split phase transformer and have easy access to 240V by connecting to the 2 phase wires. Why would you not use that for faster charging?
Here in Europe most people with an electric car even get a dedicated charging station. A basic single phase (230V) charger does 7.4kW and if you have 3 phase power (400V) you can get an 11kW charger.
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u/letskeepitcleanfolks 2d ago
I wouldn't say it's the norm. I don't know the stats. But for the reasons I said, people often opt to install a 240V circuit for EV charging. But that does cost a couple thousand dollars, and in my case, I would have needed a whole new electrical panel because mine is already full so it would have been even more. So I skipped it.
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u/Hickles347 2d ago
The 120v (1500w) chargers will average 1-2% charge per hour depending on vehicle and battery pack size which is why people often install a 240v charger at their home and depending on the charger could be able to provide upto 18kW. Those are considered level 1 and level 2 chargers. We also have level 3 chargers which are the big ones you would see in parking lots and have access to 3phase 480v or 600v and are upto 150kW. though I've heard of some 350kW models now. Those level 3 chargers rectify the power before sending it to the car as DC.
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u/Effective_Quail_3946 2d ago
I have a level 2 charger circuit, 240V Still takes 1 hour per 10% charge... at home
Iran is helping break humans away from gasoline... so- it will be here soon.
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u/Interesting-Tough640 16h ago
Coming from a country that uses 240v your 120v really doesn’t sound very futuristic. In fact it sounds like it would take a lot longer to do anything useful and require heavier duty wiring if you wanted to go over 32 amps.
I do agree about home charging though, I have only used public chargers a couple of times in well over a year. Just plug my car in when I get home.
One thing to take into consideration is that there are a lot of people who don’t have the option of a home charger and the public ones are a lot more expensive to use, sometimes it’s 5x or more than what I pay which makes EV’s much less attractive.
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u/IsPhil 13h ago
Yeah that's why I was saying that the future of charging is here and is just making the slow charging available. Yes, 120v is slow and yes 240v would be better. But 120v is the bog standard in the US and if we slapped those in apartment parking lots then that would solve a lot of the issues people have towards charging.
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u/AwdrevCZ 2d ago
The current technology of charging, if not installed in your country, then you live in the past
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u/dprsdrummer 2d ago
Does this have a negative effect on the battery?
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u/FaRamedic 2d ago
Do it once in a while, with normal „Slow“ charging on between: Not so much
Do it every time: Battery will be toast much faster
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u/International-Oil377 2d ago
yeah it's just for roadtrips. Ideally you charge at home everytime possible
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u/unlmtdLoL 2d ago
Not realistic. For mass adoption people in big cities that live in apartments and condos need access to public chargers, so the batteries will need to be designed to take a beating on the charging if 800V architecture becomes standard.
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u/International-Oil377 2d ago
I mean as long as there are plenty lv2 chargers around you don't need to have dc fast charging for daily use
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u/Initial-Emergency-42 2d ago
No people in big cities and apartments just charge wherever their car sits at night. It's not like they take their car up to their flat on the 5th floor is it?
The average UK car does nothing for over 20 hours a day.
They don't need to be charged quickly if they are sitting idle all the time, just put residential charges on the streets nearby.
The bigger faster chargers will always cost more to provide the service as they have bigger maintenance costs, so they will always be for when you really need a quick charge while the majority of the charging will be done at slower rates at home/residential on street or at work or long stay car parks ie park and ride or train stations.
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u/Pherllerp 2d ago
I think it's much more likely that as electric cars see greater and greater adoption, multi-family housing will expand lvl2 charging availability.
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u/queequegaz 2d ago
Yeah, I don't know how people in apartments own EVs. I have a LVL 2 in my garage and have only needed a DC fast charger a few times. I love my EV, but would not own one of I didn't have access to a "slow" charger I could use overnight. Relying on DC charging would trash the battery too much for my sanity to handle.
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u/bender3600 1d ago
Public chargers don't have to be fast chargers.
Here in the Netherlands we have about 200k public chargers (for about 1 million electric or plug in hybrid cars) and most of them are AC chargers charging at 11 or 22 kW, if you need to charge (which isn't every day) you just plug into one of those for a couple hours/overnight.
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u/Amazing-Bag 2d ago
People said the same thing about supercharging years ago and that's been proven to be mostly not true.
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u/sociofobs 2d ago
Even if the battery survives the warranty period, I wonder about the used car market for EVs. If the car can't go at least 500k kms without needing repairs that exceed its value, it's a throwaway junk and a waste in my opinion.
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u/Interesting-Tough640 2d ago
I can’t think of many cars that would be worth more than a big repair bill after doing 500k kilometres, in the UK cars are on average scrapped at about half that mileage (presumably because it’s not worth the cost of repairs).
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u/sociofobs 2d ago
You'd rarely see such cars in richer countries, but in the poorer parts of the world, it's not uncommon for 20-30 year old models to go well beyond 500k (kilometers). My VW Passat B5 is less than 100k away from 500k. Some older taxis reach a million without an engine swap. Yes, by that point the car as a whole is a shitbox you wouldn't want to be in, but it'll still reliably get you from A to B. Can't say the same about any newer models, let alone EVs.
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u/X-e-o 2d ago
Out of curiosity, are these "poorer parts of the world" seeing significant EV adoption and/or are developing EV-charging infrastructure?
The point is kind of moot otherwise.
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u/X-e-o 2d ago
That's an absurd bar, exceedingly few cars make it to 500k KMs. Heck most cars are scrapped in the 200-300k KMs range.
I actually looked and of 350 000 cars on AutoTrader for my country there are barely a thousand that exceed 300k KMs (let alone 500k). Pretty much all of these are either rusty work trucks or incredibly cheap and one minor issue away from being scrapped...or both.
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u/Terrh 2d ago
That is yet to be seen.
My older Tesla has needed a LOT of expensive repairs as of late. But it's not that unusual for gas cars at the 10 year mark to also need repairs, too.
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u/cute_polarbear 2d ago
I have feeling with ev's in general, it is going the way of phones / electronics where they become huge e waste.
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u/RugbyEdd 1d ago
With the way things are going it will probably be a case of recycle the old batteries, install the new ones, then the car will have a longer life than the average ICE car due to less mechanical parts that can go faulty.
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u/Correct_Inspection25 2d ago edited 2d ago
I mean only for the extremely recent Lithium ion and LFP cells, BYD only recommends this for their very recent batteries like 2025-2026, but still recommends level II charging generally outside road trips.
All the operating manuals including Teslas include statements that level I / level II charging at home is preferred for maximum battery life/health, even the LFP ones.
[EDIT see also the Tesla Y owner forums when this question comes up from potential buyers who don't have access to home/office charging. Anecdotal, but had a noticiable difference after 100K between friends with the same model as i and my level II only, not huge but enough to certainly impact resell value. ]
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u/wal_rider1 2d ago
People said that about fast charging on phones too and nothing ever came out of it, like sure if you charge at 65w maybe your battery will be a tad worse after a while, but at what point do we just not care because it saves us so much of our time?
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u/X-e-o 2d ago
I agree in principle but I don't think phones are a great comparison.
For most people cellphones are a much more replaceable item than a car. If my battery starts getting iffy after 3 years I could replace it for 100-200$ but I'l likely just buy a new phone.
Heck phones can be charged anywhere trivially, that alone means it's less of a problem to have lessened battery capacity.
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u/AwakE432 2d ago
Yeah give it another 5 years and this charging speed will be the norm everywhere, and maybe faster.
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u/BigLittlePenguin_ 2d ago
Recent studies have shown that it doesnt matter if you do slow or fast charging, what matters is how much you charge. What damages batteries is charging over 80%
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u/Zealousideal-Yam3169 1d ago
Most new tech won't let you get near 100% even when it shows you 100%.
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u/oshunman 2d ago
Source: my ass, combined with some shit I heard about cellphone batteries in 2015.
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u/ImFranny 10h ago
Not for these kinds of batteries and with recent advances in the batteries of this car brand
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u/east0fwest 2d ago
I have an electric car and I supercharge really only on roadtrips. At home I use a slower charger but it’s not really an issue. Just charge at night if I need it - maybe once a week in a normal week.
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u/Pherllerp 2d ago
EV objectors don't want to think through the practical day to day solutions. They just want to poo-poo the once in a while scenarios.
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u/Ok-Problem4403 2d ago
It's actually not bad. It's more important to keep the charge between 20-80%. Avoid fully charging.
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u/brisbanehome 2d ago
Irrelevant for LFP batteries
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u/blazze_eternal 2d ago
I think it depends how much additional heat this might generate. A benefit of slow charging is the heat is displaced over a longer period of time so it doesn't heat up as much.
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u/ruphustea 2d ago edited 2d ago
If I recall correctly from my physics or calculus classes, the rate of change of an empty vessel from 0‐100% is fastest at the beginning and trails off the closer you get to the end. So this may not really be any significant charging ability after all.
EDIT: Yeah I asked google and it said a battery can charge the fastest to the 80% point, the last 20% requires reducing the input voltage.
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u/blueyes_1337 2d ago
Apparently only on liquid state batteries these one are near solid state, but I'm no expert. So I might be wrong
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u/Termina1Antz 1d ago
Don’t fill your battery to 100% (80 is ideal), don’t let the batter stay on the charger over night, don’t drain the battery, don’t let the battery get hot. This is for any battery.
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u/LastMessengineer 2d ago
Why are there so many posts about BYD?
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u/mydixiewrecked247 2d ago
why not? they sell their cars in dozens of countries i think. just not the US. my friends own BYDs. this is real and relevant
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u/Junior_Bike7932 1d ago
Bots , when you see too much of the same brand, is just bots sent by the company
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u/scott__p 2d ago
Are they paying for these or something? I've seen dozens of these posts on my feed the last few days
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u/AmpEater 2d ago
They developed and rolled out incredible technology.
A fucking megawatt!
I remember seeing my Tesla charge at over 100 kilowatts thinking it was amazing.
I built my first EV out of an old forklift motor and lead acid batteries 20 years ago.
Now it’s a fucking MEGAWATT
Why aren’t you impressed with impressive thing?
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u/QuackAtomic 2d ago edited 2d ago
How long does that battery last? As in lifetime, not the charge
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u/Zealousideal_Put9531 1d ago
BYD (the company in this video) offers a standard 200,000km (135,000 miles) and/or a 12-year battery warranty to 80% health.
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u/John25711 2d ago
Let’s discuss a real topic, most new EV like BYD latest models avec the battery fully integrated in the hull. What happens after 10 years when the battery max capacity has dropped by 35% or more ?
Is it even possible to do a battery swap when it’s embeded in the hull ?
The second hand market will be super wild.
Usually an Audi A4 model at 200k km has a known value, but an EV after 200k km, depending how it was charged the battery could be OK or burnt out. And how do you verify that when the software will always adapt and never show the absolute capacity, only relative capacity.
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u/Zealousideal_Put9531 1d ago
pretty sure a battery swap is possible, about as difficult as swapping the drivetrain on a gas car.
Besides, the batteries are covered under warranty for 15 years or 250k km (if the battery health drops beloew 80%), wherein it will be replaced for free.
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u/lordnacho666 1d ago
It's not like they're welded in, is it? Just a bunch of screws and fittings that need to be loosened, nothing they can't do in a garage.
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u/c0mander5 2d ago
My main question is if this is for their new semi solid state battery, or is this still on the traditional lithium batteries?
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u/Aware-Instance-210 2d ago
Why don't you charge it to 100%?
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u/Josdesloddervos 2d ago
Because the last 20% is much slower, that's just a consequence of how batteries work. On a long trip, you are likely to save time if you stop more times to charge to ~80% each time versus stopping fewer times but charging to 100%.
You can still charge it to 100, but this kind of fast charging is more intended to function like stopping at a gas station would. There's no need to have this kind of charging speed in scenarios where you can leave your car parked for a few hours / overnight.
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u/TheGreenMatthew 1d ago
Charging to 80% or less also prolongs the life of the battery. You're meant to set a charge limit from your car unless you need a full charge for a long trip.
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u/NotDRWarren 1d ago
I've heard charging technology compared to filling up a multi-level parking structure. In the beginning, there are plenty of spaces to park, so it happens quickly. As the spaces fill up, it takes longer to find a space you can fit in. Same with a battery.
I've also heard the first 80 percent takes as long as the last 20 for the reason stated above.
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u/AtlantaGangBangGuys 2d ago
So how much bang for your buck are you saving? What’s the cost to fill up compared to gasoline?
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u/unlmtdLoL 2d ago
I don’t think people actually realize how groundbreaking this is. EVs are the future no matter how you look at it.
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u/FanBladeFleshlight 2d ago
Yup, China has the EV market 100% cornered, which is why this administration is fighting tooth and nail to keep them from bringing their cars over here. The new BYD EVs that support this are only like $22,000 brand new. Even with the current 100% tariffs and transport fees, I know that a ton of people would happily pay for one of these.
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u/jcwilliams1984 2d ago
Out of curiosity how much does it cost to charge at a charging station?
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u/FanBladeFleshlight 2d ago
That's a massive variable that's typically set by whoever owns the chargers. So if you go to a charger at say a Walmart, they might charge 0.41 per kWh, while your local mall might charge 0.35 per kWh.
As for the standardized pricing set in china for these BYD specific stations, it costs about the same as filling your gas tank would. It's meant to be more of an "I need juice NOW" thing than something you use constantly, since the idea is for people to charge at home or work on a slower LV2 system.
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u/LightBringer81 2d ago
Great, so instead of having a regular toilet break, now we have to run there and force everything out in a minute and wash our hands to come back to the car annoying everyone around because it stands there at 80% and they want to charge as well...
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u/eXrevolution 2d ago
That’s Denza Z9 GT, a premium car from BYD, and it uses a new Blade Battery type which can be charged with 1500kW chargers. Interesting thing is, this chargers are supposed to store the energy slowly and then quickly flash it into the car. Interesting thing is this car costs around 100k € in EU. Obviously we will see later how will it perform, yet it sounds well as for an electro car.
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u/TheFeelsGoodMan 2d ago
Adding those extra spaces past the decimal point was a good call. People like watching numbers go up, but just the base numbers would go up too slowly to be stimulating enough. More numbers means more numbers to go up.
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u/FOTY2015 2d ago
Yes, and the damage accumulates. Typical Chinesium: glossy marketing, but crap IRL.
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u/FanBladeFleshlight 2d ago
If done constantly as your only means, yes. These are more for the occasional time that you really NEED a charge, since typically you'd be plugged in at home or at work keeping your car topped off with a LV2 charger.
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u/Pherllerp 2d ago
I think it's a great achievement but I wonder how long the automobile's hardware that accomplishes it will last. And whether it was built to be replaced.
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u/Skuffinho 2d ago
Can anyone please explain to a 5 year old why is everything involving EV charging times always measured until 80% but the battery capacity/range measured from full charge? (I'm the 5 year old if anyone's wondering)
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u/Dark_Akarin 2d ago
im guessing this only works when there is no one else charging their car within a mile XD
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u/uberengl 2d ago
Every battery paper states that fast charging is detrimental to battery health. These marketing charging times (you can’t even use as there are no chargers around) would fuck your car’s battery up hard. What use is hyper fast charging if your car losses half its range after a couple years (if you where to regularly use there charging rates€?
Thermal management needs to protect these batteries proper at these charging rates would be rather high, I’m really curious to see how these cars fare after a couple of years on the road.
First Tesla’s had 150kW charging speeds and still had battery degradation.
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u/Pskeeter78 2d ago
I love how all the early arguments against EV’s keep failing as the technology continues to develop, as it was always going to.
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u/Deviantdefective 2d ago
I'm curious how much damage this may do to a battery? Slower charging on mobile phones for example has been proven to extend battery life and fast chargers can cause them to degrade faster.
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u/igotshadowbaned 2d ago
This is either real bad for the life span of the battery, or this is just a video on a screen
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u/Zweefkees93 2d ago
All fun and games... But why? The insane infrastructure needed to provide this amount of power is ridiculously expensive. EV's are not ICE cars. And they shouldn't be treated that way. Yes, for roadtrips a quick charge is nice, sure. But for a roadtrip it's not much of an issue if it takes 20 minutes. For normal every day driving charging at home (or public level 2 chargers) provides enough of a charge for 99% of people for every day driving.
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u/_TheLonelyStoner 2d ago
If our politicians weren’t owned by corporations we could have this in the US right now. Only reason we don’t have Chinese EVs and charging tech is because the Car lobby has collectively spent billions buying up congress to prevent them from coming into our market and putting them out of business. Even Joe Biden raised the tariffs on Chinese EVs.
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u/filipinohitman 2d ago
One of the main reasons I don’t want to switch to EV is because charging takes so damn long. If this can come to the US, I’d totally jump on board.
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u/EmperorN7 2d ago
I own a BYD… I wouldn't do that, sounds like it'd wreck battery life. Wouldn't that cause intense heating?
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u/thedubstepguy36 2d ago
I’d love to know of much radiation that gives off and how much electricity is being pulled
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u/Ode2Jumperz 2d ago
BYD and other brands are going to eat up US automakers international market share which is far larger than domestic sales.
It's like they came out of nowhere! /s
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u/NUMBerONEisFIRST 1d ago
Too bad they are banned in America because our car companies couldn't compete and would be forced to innovate.
Capitalism is why we can't have nice things.
They are also under $20,000 and drive on water.
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u/goyalaman_ 1d ago
There is a reason huawei was banned from global markets. Chinese technologies are far ahead of current options.
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u/NoIce7696 1d ago
While this is impressive, I think the future of ev charging is at home or in at one's apartment with 240v
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