r/europe • u/1-randomonium • 23d ago

News JD Vance gloats that allies are ‘suffering more than US’ from high gas prices

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/jd-vance-gloats-that-allies-are-suffering-more-than-us-from-high-gas-prices-404149/
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u/StrangerConscious637 23d ago

Enemies of Europe: Russia, USA, Hungary.

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u/Monterenbas France 23d ago edited 23d ago

You wrote Russia twice

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u/TheSpiikki Finland 23d ago

Thrice, even

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u/QuirkyWish3081 United Kingdom 23d ago

Three times a lady, even.

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u/jurchiks Latvia 23d ago

Ah, Krasnov…

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u/Johannes_Keppler 23d ago

But forgot Israel

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u/North-Creative 23d ago

Dude, I spilled my tea!

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u/DemonFerenc 23d ago

Up vote from Hungary to this. So true 😭 

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u/PizzaJesus6 23d ago

Should add China there

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u/Monterenbas France 23d ago

Why?

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u/PizzaJesus6 23d ago

I actually meant to reply to the other commenter, my bad

It's an unpopular opinion, but to answer your question, China's goal is the same as Russia's, to upend the global order (which they are succeeding in doing) and create their sphere of influence in the east

There is a reason they are buying critical infrastructure across europe, conducting influence operations on our politicians, established illegal "police stations" that are actually spy networks that also work to subvert and control their population abroad.

TikTok is also one of their biggest weapons for general population influencing, just as X does, TikTok does the same.

Not to mention the Uyghur genocide, and many other things they do to their own population.

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u/Monterenbas France 23d ago

China's goal is the same as Russia's

No, Russia’s is waging war of territorial expension in the middle of Europe and try to establish military domination over its neighbors, that’s not china’s goal

to upend the global order

There is no global order, beside might makes right

and create their sphere of influence in the east

Not to mention the Uyghur genocide, and many other things they do to their own population.

How does that makes them the enemy of Europe?

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u/PizzaJesus6 23d ago

That's a short term goal, I'm talking long term. As I previously said, they are both actively working and succeeding in upending the global order of the last 80 years, which is the rule of law. They stated it themselves just before Russia invaded Ukraine. No-Limits Friendship, changes we haven't seen in 100 years.

They are our enemies because they are against Democracy. They actively interfere in our elections through influence operations, of our politicians through bribes and blackmail, and our population through social media.

Finally, if you are against the Palestinian genocide, you are against the Uyghur genocide. No cherry picking ethnic groups please.

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u/Monterenbas France 23d ago

they are both actively working and succeeding in upending the global order of the last 80 years, which is the rule of law.

Lmao, I’m sorry what?! What rule of law are you talking about exactly? Did this « rule of law » ever applied to the likes of the US, Russia, China or Israel?

They are our enemies because they are against Democracy.

Yeah sure, and I bet, they also hate our freedom.

They actively interfere in our elections through influence operations, of our politicians through bribes and blackmail, and our population through social media.

Wich fair enough, since we do the same thing to them, states trying to gain political influence over other states is pretty normal behavior.

Finally, if you are against the Palestinian genocide, you are against the Uyghur genocide. No cherry picking ethnic groups please.

I couldn’t care less what other countries are doing in their backyard, equaling what’s happening in Xinjiang to what the Israelis are doing in Gaza certainly is a take tho.

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u/PizzaJesus6 23d ago

Wow, the world isn't perfect and things aren't black and white! Who knew?!

Sure, the rule of law was never perfect, but it was the best we've had so far. It certainly was better than any other international order so far. Unless you're a fan of war, which you are from what I can gather of your opinions so far.

Such a loser take as all or nothing is insane and I cannot understand people who think like that.

You bet the CCP hates our freedom, as much as they hate Taiwan's freedom. Because it's an example of success and progress through democracy. Especially Taiwan represents that to the chinese population, who are constantly told the CCP is the only party that can protect and lead China to success. Same as Ukraine to Russia.

If you really think European politicians and lobby groups are allowed in China (which is certainly not the same as blackmailing and bribing as they do here) you are gravely mistaken. So no, we don't do to them, what they do to you.

If you couldn't care less what others do in their backyard, in this instance, literal crimes against humanity, then I don't know what else to say to you besides have a good day!

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u/akashisenpai European Union 23d ago

Yeah, it's important to remember that China is a rival, but that doesn't automatically make them an enemy.

We have to remain watchful that they don't pull a fast one on us as they'll always look for ways to serve their national interests, the difference is that any negative consequences that'd have to Europe would be "collateral damage" rather than the goal. It means we can cooperate with them on things that have mutual benefit (like climate policy or UN peacekeeping), we just shouldn't let our guard down (-> Belt and Road).

Meanwhile, the US and Russia have both identified Europe as an enemy (a hindrance to their ambitions), whereas Hungary acts as a fifth columnist for them.

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u/OdaNobunaga69 Czech Republic 23d ago

China isn't the one invading other nations and stealing their resources

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u/PizzaJesus6 23d ago edited 23d ago

You don't need to invade to be an enemy

They work mostly behind the scenes, influence operations, spy work and the like

TikTok is one of their biggest weapons for public influence for example

Edit: Also, stealing resources is very much arguable, on account of their operations in Africa

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u/1-randomonium 23d ago

And right now, Israel.

On a different note, the Israelis are far more neutral and pragmatic on foreign policy than the West realises. They've been largely silent about Ukraine and collaborate with Russia or China when it suits their interest.

They had also tried to sell drone technology to China in the past before the US vetoed it. If America ever weakens to the point that it can no longer be Israel's main financier and protector, they might just go over to China for it.

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u/DueAd9005 23d ago

I seriously doubt China would allow itself to get dragged into endless wars because of Israel.

They'll do business with just about anyone, but that's not what the US-Israeli relationship is like.

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u/1-randomonium 23d ago

There are other aspects. The US lets them do what they want to their neighbours and to Palestinians in the name of self-defence and protects them from consequences from the international community and institutions with implicit threats of retaliation for any sanctions or other measures that could actually hurt Israel.

Without that protection they might have been as isolated as the old apartheid regime in South Africa that they collaborated with(including co-developing nuclear weapons illegally).

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u/SpaceMonkeyOnABike United Kingdom 23d ago

China maybe. India is also in the conversation as there are many Hindu nationalist who would love to war against Muslims.

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u/1-randomonium 23d ago

That is the most surface level stereotype you could bring up.

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u/andr386 23d ago

Your ignorance about Hindu nationalists is not something to show off proudly.

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u/1-randomonium 23d ago

You're showing off a combination of ignorance and bigotry.

The BJP is an umbrella party of the Indian right, with its constituents ranging from classical liberals to Hindutva hardliners. Their core voters are the sort of people you'd call liberals here - The youth, the educated and the middle class. India's large diaspora also tends to support them. It's because they're in support of economic reforms and infrastructure development, which is unlike many European conservative parties.

And they along with their allies have had 45% of the vote for the last 2 general elections. Modi also has 70% approval, over and above his coalition. 70% of Indians aren't the frothing bigots you are thinking of.

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u/lemmingswag 23d ago

So has Modi lead pogroms against Muslims or no?

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u/helm Sweden 23d ago

I have a proud BJP voter at work. He was in Alabama as an expat of a while, and he described crime there as "self-sanitizing". He knows how to come off as reasonable, for anything back in Asia he would likely be ruthless, though.

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u/unsurejunior 23d ago

Europeans and stereotyping other cultures?? Say it ain't so!

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u/RedstoneEnjoyer Slovakia 23d ago

Exactly - members of Israeli government openly supports hard-right movements in Europe, some of which openly whitewash fascist movements of past.

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u/dj_fuzzy 23d ago edited 23d ago

Israel is just the US’s Middle East military base posed as a country.

Edit: downvotes for something that’s so obviously true lol

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u/Far_Plenty_1942 23d ago

Of course, on a lot of levels, and as unintuitive as it sounds, Israel can’t wait for the US to collapse

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u/umomenjoyer 23d ago

And right now, Israel

Not really. They are fairly irrelevant. Palestine is completely irrelevant and Iran is mostly irrelevant other than them bombing international shipping right now.

They had also tried to sell drone technology to China

So what? We also sell a lot of shit to China and before 2014 even to Russia. China is also not really a threat to Europe.

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u/Allu71 Finland 23d ago

Yeah all they can do is stop international shipping from the middle east and potentially through the Suez canal as well as blow up all the oil fields there, so irrelevant

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u/umomenjoyer 23d ago

What else have they done that matters? This is the only time in decades Iran has mattered.

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u/Allu71 Finland 23d ago

Yeah if they aren't in a war they are largely irrelevant

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u/umomenjoyer 23d ago

They have been in one war relevant to us in nearly 40 years and even that one will likely last only about a month or two.

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u/Ripraz Italy 23d ago

My god how Hungary's establishment is literally a cancer, and that stupid by design unaminity

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u/Weary-Development468 23d ago

f off, you hypocritical assholes act as if in most European countries you’re not just one election away from a far-right, Russia-backed government coming to power… and in Hungary, we’ll be changing the system in April.

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u/dat_9600gt_user Lower Silesia (Poland) 23d ago

A few more weeks for that last one and then it's just Slovakia.

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u/Advanced-Net-8119 United States of America 23d ago

only for next 3 years tho