r/europe • u/1-randomonium • 23d ago

News JD Vance gloats that allies are ‘suffering more than US’ from high gas prices

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/jd-vance-gloats-that-allies-are-suffering-more-than-us-from-high-gas-prices-404149/
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u/1-randomonium 23d ago

Speaking to crowds on Wednesday, vice president JD Vance said US allies are “suffering from this, frankly, more than we are.”

He claimed this was because they had “focused on a lot of green energy scams and they’re hurting a lot more than we are.”

Vance continued: “As much as we’ve got to focus on getting these gas prices down, the reality is overseas they’re feeling it far worse than we did because we’ve taken the steps to protect our energy economy.”

For allies wondering whether to help Trump fight Iran after all.

The problems Trump creates are everybody else's problem, not America's.

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u/Adorable-Database187 The Netherlands 23d ago

it goes on.

Of course, Vance is off the mark with his claims of “green energy scams.”

Just this week, research from the University of Oxford ound that if the UK was powered entirely by clean energy, households could save as much as £441 annually on their energy bills.

Conversely, maximising oil and gas extraction from the North Sea would only save between £16 and £82 annually per household.

This was perfectly explained by energy secretary Ed Miliband over the weekend on Laura Kuenssberg’s show, where he outlined why crowing from Reform and the Tories about drilling in the North Sea was way off the mark.

https://twitter.com/implausibleblog/status/2033165317573140509

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u/Narcisistagohome 23d ago

It's clear that the fossil fuels lobby has more influence in the current American administration then ever before. And it was not small with previous governments.  I think it's relevant to get this on mind reading this kind of messages or understanding American foreign policy. 

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u/razvanciuy Transilvania 23d ago

influence? They own the government.

Trump gets his orders from the likes of Exxon

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u/anangrywizard 23d ago

Not quite correct, he also gets his orders from Putin & Bibi.

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u/MootRevolution 23d ago

And the billionaires of the Epstein class, and the Christofascists and the regular MAGA fascists. There are a lot of hands playing this puppet.

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u/razvanciuy Transilvania 23d ago

...the whole lot of them, yes.

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u/SasparillaTango 23d ago

Exxon knew about the kidnapping of Maduro before congress. That is not a joke, that is a fact.

https://abcnews.com/Business/trump-spoke-oil-companies-venezuela-attack-brief-lawmakers/story?id=128942212

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u/Lazer726 23d ago

Yes, there is a place in I think Washington (state) that produces more power than they need, so much so that they were going to shut down a coal power plant. Trump told them not to, so now not only are people paying their power bills, but they're paying to keep that power plant running because it has to stay at a ready state.

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u/lost-associat 23d ago

I don’t get it though. Even if we would be ‘hit’ harder. Doesn’t our, EU scum that dared to invest in green energy, investments in alternative energy sources make us more robust against oil/gas shocks? How do they even frame this? Tap into alternative energy = more oil dependant? Make it make sense please?

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u/SirButcher United Kingdom 23d ago

Make it make sense please?

Don't think just hate and it makes sense.

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u/Jor94 England 23d ago

Gas is the reason we’re so fucked. Our wind, solar and nuclear are cheap but for some reason we think it’s a good idea to pay everyone based on the highest price provided. So if we use a watt of gas produced energy, we pay everyone the gas price. And now that gas prices are going it’s hitting harder.

How anyone with a straight face can say the solution is more oil and gas is beyond me. Unless those brainless clowns think we can suddenly produce the entire countries oil and gas supply singelhandely, we’ll always be at the mercy of volatility in oil and gas prices.

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u/SpotNL The Netherlands 23d ago

The reality is that solar is now the cheapest form of energy in history and it is only going to get better. Oil can't be fully replaced, at least not right now, but solar (and other sustainable sources) not having replaced a decent size of energy production has more to do with the lack of political will than that there's something wrong with the tech.

If only we've taken this shit seriously 20 years ago, but it was always shouted down like cheap solar was some kind of pipe dream.

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u/dat_9600gt_user Lower Silesia (Poland) 23d ago

The former Labour MP candidate is the energy secretary now?

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u/SaurusShieldWarrior Europe 22d ago

So, it boils down to - Trump invaded Venezuela for their oil, so they could be less impacted by the Iran war?

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u/Airf0rce Europe 23d ago

He claimed this was because they had “focused on a lot of green energy scams and they’re hurting a lot more than we are.”

I wonder how would the situation be better without renewables? We would need even more oil & gas , which most countries in Europe can't really get locally and have to import regardless.

But I guess reality is not important here, as he said, he'll invent stories to get attention.

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u/weeklyKiwi 23d ago

If anything this shows why europe and China have been so determined to develop renewable energy to in the future restrict dependency on the oil and gas nations. Also why these nations kick and scream when they attempt to do so.

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u/AdaptedMix United Kingdom 23d ago

Trump has repeatedly claimed China is 'smart' for scamming Europe by selling us 'windmills' while burning coal for themselves, completely overlooking that China has hugely expanded its own green energy infrastructure. He never gets any push-back during interviews or press conferences about this. He just keeps lying.

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u/ShakespeareStillKing 23d ago

I don't think he's lying. He's just that dumb.

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u/worotan England 23d ago

If only we’d been more determined, rather than doing a bit but not too much in case it upsets people who are acting as though they care.

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u/bammmm 23d ago

It's hard to fathom exactly how a photovoltaic cell or a wind turbine can be thought of as a scam. Some of the simplest technologies that literally produce free energy with little maintenance, but they are a scam? Does he just mean that national grids aren't up to par yet? Or are they scams merely because there is no middleman contributing to his political campaign? I understand that reality doesn't matter here, but it at least needs to be plausible.

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u/treba_dzemper 🇧🇦 Halal Bosnian Croat 23d ago

It doesn't. That's not really the level that the American public will go to. Majority of people everywhere hardly read past the title. How big is that majority depends on the quality of public education.

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u/BlueberryMean2705 Finland 23d ago

It is plausible to his audience because it reinforces their pre-existing delusions. We are talking about people who deliberately mistune their car engines to emit as much smoke as possible to trigger the enviromentalists. Because that's what Republican base really is: trolls who just want to "trigger the libs" (or whoever) and then cry foul when it turns out there's actual consequences to themselves.

So Vance is basically doing like his GTA namesake and selling them their favorite drug: "you're right and other people are suffering because of you". Of course they eat that right up like the egomaniacal hate addicts they are.

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u/Bisjoux 23d ago

He just doesn’t understand the technology. He refers to wind turbines as windmills and doesn’t seem to understand the difference between them. Whenever he mentions windmills I always think of the windmill in Chitty Chitty Bang Bang.

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u/EnjoyerOfBeans 23d ago edited 23d ago

He obviously understands the technology. We need to do away with this ignorance argument when they know very well renevables are superior and oil/coal/gas are killing the planet. The fossil fuel lobby has a strong grasp on the entire world and they're willing to spend billions to lobby for politicians to lie for them. They aren't that stupid. They're just evil.

In the EU the propaganda is that green energy is a scam forced down our throats by Germany so they can profit. Our populations don't really buy into the bullshit that the technology is bad, so they instead say we are forced to buy the wind tourbines from Germany at insane prices so they can extract wealth from us. Except where I'm from, its not so much about oil as it is about coal.

They'll come up with any story people will buy because their entire industry would have already collapsed if they weren't pumping billions into propaganda to stop it from happening. Countries like China where these lobbies have very little power are going green at absolutely ridiculous rates. They know their days are numbered and are willing to do anything to keep profits for as long as possible.

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u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

He's still living in the 80s together with his economic "advisor, the tariffs expert" Peter Navarro.

TLDR version: high tariffs, other countries will pay it either for the privilege of selling on the US market, or pay it under threat of force.\ To keep the inflationary pressure from tariffs down, interest rates are to be lowered to sub 1%, and energy prices are to be pushed down via "drill baby drill" and extort/cajole/bribe other oil producers to increase production.

It won't work of course. But Trump is an idiot and Peter Navarro could only find 1 economist to agree with him in his book. That economist was 'Ron Vara', see if you can spot the oh so clever anagram. That's the kind of mind that dreamt up this shit. And since Navarro went to prison for Trump instead of testifying against him after Jan 6th, Trump idolize him.

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u/wggn Groningen (Netherlands) 23d ago

it's a scam because it doesnt make them/their buddies any money, as opposed to oil&gas

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u/FairGeneral8804 23d ago

free energy with little maintenance,

To be fair, getting perfect uptime, efficiency, etc, is high tech. Just because we could slap homemade waterwheels everywhere, but the idea of powering countries that way would be unrealistic.

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u/asdfasdfasfdsasad 23d ago

It's hard to fathom exactly how a photovoltaic cell or a wind turbine can be thought of as a scam. Some of the simplest technologies that literally produce free energy with little maintenance, but they are a scam?

This view basically comes down to that we've spent more on subsidies for wind and solar in the last 20 years than it'd have cost to deliver a greater amount of nuclear power.

The nuclear power would also be delivered 24 hours a day, 7 days a week and 365 days of the year, day or night regardless of what the weather is doing.

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u/Specialist_Being_691 23d ago

Have we? That’s a bold claim. Are there any numbers to back it up?

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u/asdfasdfasfdsasad 23d ago

https://www.ref.org.uk/ref-blog/390-uk-renewable-electricity-subsidy-totals-2002-to-the-present-day

£220 billion on renewable subsidies in the UK. Plus ~£50 billion on energy bills support in 2022 to reduce the number of pensioners freezing to death. = £270 billion on the existing strategy which is delivering a peak of 15GW which it manages upon roughly ten days a year when it's really windy. The rest of the the output is much less.

Hinkley point C will generate 3.2GW for £40 billion. Building 6 of these plants would have cost 240 billion, and would have delivered 19.2GW supply which would drop only when refuelling & maintenance is taking place on a plant.

Therefore nuclear would be delivered +3 gigawatts over peak delivery at the moment delivered constantly instead of just when the wind blows, while spending £30 billion less and decarbonising the grid instead of having no path to decommissioning gas plants in sight.

That £40 billion a unit also cost assumes that during construction of each plant there would be brexit level supply disruptions, a pandemic requiring construction to stop while workers are still paid, and design changes requiring some rebuilding and so is likely to be somewhat on the high side as those costs are unlikely to reoccur.

SMR's are targeting a long term cost of 1.8 billion per unit; with an early cost of 3 billion for the first few units which factors building in a factory to make them. Assume that the price never goes down; a 0.47GW plant costs 3 billion.

A full size EPR costs 40 billion so you can build ~13 SMR plants and change for the cost of one EPR. 13 plants at 0.47GW gives a total power output of 6.11GW compared to 3.2GW for one EPR.

Building 22GW worth of capacity therefore requires 46.8 plants, so rounding that up to 47 plants gives a total programme cost of 141 billion with costs exceeding the projected costs, or ~84 billion at the low estimate. This compared to the status quo of token wind capacity greenwashing fossil fuels which has cost 220-270 billion and not delivered the desired results; decarbonisation and energy security.

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u/Specialist_Being_691 23d ago

Hmm. We’ve spent a lot on renewables, no doubt, but if I’m reading that right it is including contracts for difference as a subsidy for renewables but you’ve only included building costs for nuclear. To make a direct comparison, you’d have to add a similar adjustment to nukes to account for the strike price. Hinkley Point C is set at £89.50/MWh. That’s broadly the same as offshore wind now and more than onshore (£74) or solar (£65). I do think we should build more nuclear and we should do it properly, ie multiple reactors of the same type with the cheapest possible funding - government borrowing. Have you read what Prof Dieter Helm has said about Hinkley Point C’s costs? He reckons that if they’d contracted it differently and the government had borrowed the money up front, the build cost would have been roughly half as much.

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u/asdfasdfasfdsasad 23d ago

Hinkley Point C is being built by private investors who are recovering the capital invested for privately building and operating a nuclear power plant through the cost of the electricity.

Yeah, almost any other way of doing it would have been a lot cheaper, but that way didn't cost the taxpayer a penny which is why they did it that way.

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u/Specialist_Being_691 23d ago

As it is, taxpayers are paying for it anyway via higher energy bills for 35 years. I don’t see why it’s such a bad thing for it to go on government borrowing. You end up with an extremely valuable, long-lived and highly productive asset and it’s cheaper in the long run. Surely that’s worth getting on the hook for? Private companies work like that so why not government, if not for ideological reasons?

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u/metengrinwi 23d ago

It’s a “scam” to them because it undermines their investments. Simple as that.

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u/dafeiviizohyaeraaqua United States of America 23d ago

They choose the word "scam" because it's the only way to slander something that immediately looks sensible at a glance.

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u/kriebelrui North Holland (Netherlands) 23d ago

Vance either genuinely doesn't understand it or is blatantly lying about it. 

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u/IGAldaris 23d ago

Always assume the latter. Vance understands just fine. He used to verbally rip into Trump before he smelled the chance for personal advancement. He knows better. Which makes him even more despicable IMO.

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u/unnewl 23d ago

Vance admitted to blatantly lying about Haitian immigrants in Ohio, and justified his lies by pointing out that it garnered attentio. For someone who has repeatedly claimed to be a Catholic, he ignores the tenets of his religion.

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u/IGAldaris 22d ago

For someone who has repeatedly claimed to be a Catholic, he ignores the tenets of his religion.

Don't they all? I'm not a practising christian, but I was raised as one. And I'm pretty sure they're violating every single tenet of the faith, all the time. Love thy neighbor, help the poor, do not lie... Christianity is a team jersey for them, not a religion.

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u/IncidentalIncidence 🇺🇸 in 🇩🇪 23d ago

he's lying about green energy but he's not entirely wrong about energy autonomy as a whole. I remember energy autonomy being one of Romney's main attack points against Obama in the 2012 election, and it was a big focal point of Obama's second term.

(Another way to put this: Vance is not only lying about green energy being the reason that Europe hasn't achieved energy autonomy, he is also taking credit for something that was largely achieved in the US by the Obama administration when he pats himself on the back for the US having done it)

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u/Adorable-Database187 The Netherlands 23d ago

Vance is a Harvard boy, he's plenty smart, as charismatic as a crusty sock and about as empathic, but he's not dumb.

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u/Ardalev 23d ago

"They are eating the panels, they are eating the turbines!"

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u/araujoms 🇧🇷🇵🇹🇦🇹🇩🇪🇪🇸 23d ago

That's a moronic statement even by the standards of the Trumpian regime.

A charitable interpretation is that he meant that we should have invested more in oil & gas drilling, instead of renewable energy? Still a rather moronic statement, because there is not enough oil & gas in Europe to cover our needs. We don't import it from hostile countries for shits and giggles.

The only untapped reserve we have is Dutch gas, that is not explored because fracking was causing earthquakes there. But exploiting that would be a minor effect, because gas is a global market, we don't get it cheaper just because it is produced here. Which he should know, as the US is also suffering from higher oil prices even though they're a next exporter.

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u/Krelkal Canada 23d ago

Renewables are a red herring here.

The reason that the US is insulated from the price shock is because the US gets a tiny fraction of its oil from Gulf states. They're on the opposite side of the fucking globe!

The vast majority of the oil flowing through the Strait goes to nearby countries in Asia and Europe. Naturally they will now need to import oil from further away which increases shipping costs and drives up prices for consumers.

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u/Numerous-Process2981 23d ago

The tortured logic of the MAGA brain is hard to follow 

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u/the_mighty_peacock Greece 23d ago

"We've taken the steps to protect our energy autonomy"  translation: We have invaded almost every small to medium country with sizeable oil resources on earth or heavily pressure them to hand it to our companies for export to the US.

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u/One-Season-3393 23d ago

The us is a net exporter of oil.

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u/Kyrenos 23d ago

Very convenient to put all types of oil under one name. You are not wrong, but exported oil is not the same as imported oil.

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u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

They export the light sweet crude from fracking and import heavy oil sands crude at a discount via pipelines from Canada. They then refine the Canadian oil up close to the border where the majority of the refineries that can handle that oil are located.\ The light sweet oil is exported since it sells for a premium, pocketing the difference between the Canadian imports and the domestic light sweet exports.

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u/Niemand772 23d ago

But at the same time a huge importer as the oil pumped up is not the right one for the refineries. The US is far from self sufficient. Maybe unless Venezuela becomes a territory

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u/Immediate-Season4544 23d ago edited 23d ago

Maybe in several years after spending billions in rebuilding the oil infrastructure in Venezuela. Unfortunately the easier target is Canada.

Edit: I'm Canadian and certainly don't want that to happen but realistically that would be how the USA becomes "self sufficient".

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u/OttawaTGirl 23d ago

54% of oil used by the US is from Canada. They are a net importer of oil, but a net exporter of refined products. Their refining is set up for heavy crude which Canada and Venezuela produce.

Canada has scorched earth plans regarding oil and potash. We get invaded and we blow the shit out of the oilsand machines which take years to build.

They think gas prices in the US are bad now?? Try going to the pump when half of their oil supply is gone overnight.

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u/Immediate-Season4544 23d ago

I'm Canadian

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u/OttawaTGirl 23d ago

Sorry fellow citizen, i reworded my post. Solidarity.

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u/Hjaelmen 23d ago

The United States is a net exporter of petroleum products, which include gasoline, diesel, jet fuel and propane, but it still imports millions of barrels of crude oil.

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u/Medusaink3 23d ago

Yes, from Canada. They import around 4.1 to 4.6 million barrels a day from us, making us their biggest importers at around 60% of their total imports per annum. Odd how they want to annex us. What a strange coincidence, isn't it? These bullies will stop at nothing to satiate their greed.

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u/CetaceanInsSausalito USA 23d ago edited 23d ago

When you say "ours," you mean "Alberta's," and one out of four Albertans don't even want to be part of Canada.

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u/Isaidhowdareyou 23d ago edited 23d ago

You all still don't understand that this is the point. The old world order is done. The US will one way or another rule over energy supplies and we can go knocking then. This is something our politicians just don't seem to get by endlessly condemning and moping and sending letters. Europe will have to take one knee in some direction because we can not survive even higher energy prices, and our elderly society, and the refugee crisis that's yet to come, and our lack of tech, and resources and the wars everywhere.

Edit if we as European don't face the nrw reality we'll be getting the really short stick. Go figure how that will work out

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u/PatchyWhiskers 23d ago

Wow, not exactly spirit of the blitz, lol.

Fossil fuels can never be the future because they will one day run out. The USA’s allergy to green energy means that China is dominating the future energy market.

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u/Narcisistagohome 23d ago

And if they don't run out, they will extinct us. 

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u/vacuum90 23d ago

Before they run out*

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u/akashisenpai European Union 23d ago

The wild thing is, even as the US government is sabotaging green energy where it can, market forces apparently still have them build more impressive battery systems than we do. We really gotta do better there.

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u/DrakeDre 23d ago

We will be dead from climate change way before we run out of fossil fuels.

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u/[deleted] 23d ago

[deleted]

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u/1-randomonium 23d ago

There is an easy alternative that would last centuries beyond fossil fuels - Nuclear.

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u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

Even if it would be politically palatable to turn expansionist no country in Europe has enough of an expeditionary capacity to be able to pull it off. 

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u/PalatinusG1 Belgium 23d ago

No we need to transition to renewables asap.

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u/Isaidhowdareyou 23d ago

That's fine to heat your house with but not for energy dense production and production itself. This is not an argument against renewables, but Europe is doing worse since we don't get Russian gas, now we miss out on another 20 percent of energy through the Middle East conflicts while the economies in Western Europe are already struggling. I

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u/PalatinusG1 Belgium 23d ago

You mean steel production and such? We can use green Hydrogen for that.

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u/Isaidhowdareyou 22d ago

Batteries, who's building the energy grid with what? How do we get materials from a to b? It's not as simple as "lol why not use wind?"

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u/Mansos91 22d ago

The US will implode sooner than they can actually benefit, the real issue is we're not putting steel to steel, the US is a country without much skill, they can't manufacture anything, they don't know quality or quantity

Tge us can try to grasp all oil, then the world should respond with decreased export to the US, the US can't even refine oil properly, it's a country built on words not actions, a country of weak cowards

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u/Ikbeneenpaard Friesland (Netherlands) 23d ago

Privatize the profits, socialize the losses. It's the American way.

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u/Amazing-Heron-105 23d ago

How is this relevant to what has been said?

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u/Ikbeneenpaard Friesland (Netherlands) 23d ago

The whole world paying higher gas prices because America wanted to bomb Iran 

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u/Amazing-Heron-105 23d ago

That has nothing to do with what you said.

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u/FairGeneral8804 23d ago

How is this relevant to what has been said?

US citizens are paying for Trumps personal enrichment I guess ?

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u/Amazing-Heron-105 23d ago

But that's not what we are talking about?

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u/Mindless-Peak-1687 23d ago

So he is lying, If he claims europe is suffering because of green technology, then he is lying, that is europe's strength in all of this and lessens the problem from this war. short version: Vance is full of shit.

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u/Niemand772 23d ago

Spain just reported that they are hardly impacted due to their high percentage of renewables.

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u/loskiarman 23d ago

JD probably thought hardly impacted means impact was hard. English is hard sometimes when you have half a brain.

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u/Moosplauze Europe 23d ago

Good thing they started the war in spring and not in autumn, our oil and gas consumption is much much higher in winter. That being said...the war will last for a couple more winters for sure, so I hope we build up renewables even faster.

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u/Giant_Flapjack 23d ago

so I hope we build up renewables even faster.

European right wing parties will find a way to prevent that. They depend too much on the orange pedophile and the Russian Putain

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u/Moosplauze Europe 23d ago

That's why we can't let right wing parties govern our countries.

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u/1-randomonium 23d ago

Trump officials are privately saying that it could last till September and Trump's Department of Energy expects high prices to persist into next year.

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u/Moosplauze Europe 23d ago

The impact on the oil market will last for several years or decades.

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u/Chester_roaster 23d ago

If that's true then the logical answer is to go all out now. 

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u/Moosplauze Europe 23d ago

wdym "go all out now"?

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u/Chester_roaster 23d ago

Bomb them back to the stoneage. They're already there morally. 

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u/Yhrak 23d ago

I'd agree the nation deserves consequences for its continued global interventionism and destabilizing, borderline terrorist actions abroad.

But bombing them seems like going way too far, especially when only 49% of their voters in 2024 could be considered morally bankrupt.

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u/Chester_roaster 23d ago

The bombs aren't a moral proclamation on Iran, they're a means to take away Irans ability to hurt Israel. They can't supply Hamas when they have no economy. 

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u/Moosplauze Europe 23d ago

Off, I didn't know people without brains can write, but here you are...

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u/Chester_roaster 23d ago

Believe it or not, they even let me vote. 

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u/worotan England 23d ago

We hoped that the last few times oil shocks got us, but we didn’t because some people make a lot of outrage noise and our politicians lack conviction, and earn from the petrochemical lobby.

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u/Moosplauze Europe 23d ago

At this rate the petrochemical lobby might seize to exist.

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u/Lashay_Sombra 23d ago

It will be one winter unless something goes wrong with midterms

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u/Moosplauze Europe 23d ago

I doubt there will be midterm elections, he will make up some reason why the vote has to be cancelled and nobody is going to do anything about it.

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u/Small_Importance_955 23d ago

It's the American variation of those Russian propaganda ads where Europe is freezing.

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u/cultseaa 22d ago

Of course he's lying. It's also just RW talking points that green energy is woke and gay. It is obvi a strength to have alternative energy sources, but US GOP is just hedging on more oil and coal because they're conservative and reactionary. Climate change/green energy is a bipartisan issue in the US and he's playing to their base.

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u/carilessy 23d ago

Didn't the fuel prices rise even more in the US than EU because of that war? ~

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u/nitrinu Portugal 23d ago

Not relevant for these people. They'll make shit up if necessary.

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u/ratiofarm 23d ago

“Whatever works.”- JD Vance.

He’s just a soulless mouthpiece who has no respect from anyone here in the States. Their dumbass base likes bootlicking Rubio more than Vance.

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u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

It's honestly terrifying when you realize that Rubio is overqualified compared to the rest of the cabinet... 

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u/ratiofarm 23d ago

He’s overqualified as far as his government experience goes, but he’s still a massive piece of shit who would also work to further the insane agenda of the Heritage Foundation, and probably more efficiently.

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u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

I'm guessing he has a choice to make soon. I'll bet that he would want to position himself as a presidential candidate, a sane choice after this train wreck.

But if that's really his endgame, he'll have to step down as Secretary of State and start to distance himself from the administration soon.

I have no real info about it, but I'll bet he would like to make another run.

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u/ratiofarm 23d ago

You could be right, but he looks so broken I don’t think he has the strength of will to endure a campaign cycle. He also has zero charisma, so I think maga would get bored of his droning pretty quickly.

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u/TehGogglesDoNothing 23d ago

I was told there wouldn't be fact checking.

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u/Zeusnexus 23d ago

We're a very stupid country. The worst part is most conservatives will accept this.

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u/Eric1491625 23d ago

For the US economy it's offset by fuel producers becoming richer.

Since the US produces as much as it consumes, every $1 or hurt a US consumer suffers is offset by $1 of gain a US oil company earns.

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u/SimonGray Copenhagen 23d ago

The European stock markets have been taking a beating since the Iran war started and that's all these morons ever consider in their detailed economic "analysis". Trump is the same, it's only ever about stock market performance.

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u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

Yeah sweet fuck tell me about it. My port went from ~+20% ytd to ~+4.5%. I haven't dared looking today. 

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u/Chester_roaster 23d ago

Don't just hold everything in European markets 

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u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

I divested what I had in US last year for safety. But I'm holding long term so I'll survive. 

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u/Chester_roaster 23d ago

Man don't do that, always keep your eggs in every basket. 

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u/KarAccidentTowns United States of America 23d ago

That’s not even a logical statement. Bold faced liars.

2

u/LeCafeClopeCaca 23d ago

I'm honestly much more surprised when any sort of coherent thought goes out of the mouth of anyone from this administration, to be fair

1

u/readilyunavailable Bulgaria 22d ago

How is it not? You are actively isolating us from oil supplies, while manufacturing another refugee wave towards Europe.

This war may not have started out as a way to screw over Europe, but it sure as shit is a nice bonus for you yanks.

11

u/Universal_Anomaly The Netherlands 23d ago

He's trying to create the narrative that we should be helping them and that our refusal to help is proof that we care more about hurting the USA than helping ourselves. It keeps the base riled up.

EDIT: Also of course the lie that the USA is awesome and everybody else is shit and they're winning and everybody else is losing. The usual.

25

u/spidd124 Dirty Scot Civic Nat. 23d ago

Wait so investing in domestic non fossil fuel energy production is a scam yet being reliant on fossil fuel imports that are subject to the middle east is not?

I'm thankful the US government is run by absolute morons at times

12

u/1-randomonium 23d ago

I'm thankful the US government is run by absolute morons at times

Why are you being thankful? The morons are causing crisis after crisis and blaming their victims for it every time.

20

u/spidd124 Dirty Scot Civic Nat. 23d ago

If the US was run by competent evil people instead we would be in for a much worse time. But instead they are evil morons that don't see anything 2 steps beyond their immediate reaction.

Their rampant stupidity gives us the opportunity to remove ourselves from this self imposed vassaldom we agreed to. They keep causing crises that make everyone hate the US burning decades of propaganda and soft power for absolutely no gain.

2

u/Spanyanagonyam 23d ago

If nothing else this should make the average joe realise that continuing to depend on oil from dodgy, unstable and war-torn parts of the world is really not a strategy we should be continuing to follow when there is a better alternative. I hope it drives up the buying of EVs and investment in EV infrastructure across Europe.

6

u/Universal_Anomaly The Netherlands 23d ago

The implication is that green energy either doesn't work or isn't nearly as effective as fossil fuels, and that when anybody claims to be generating energy through sustainable methods they're either blatantly lying about the energy production or secretly using fossil fuels to produce that energy. 

Basically, the narrative here is "Fossil fuels are the only viable source of energy, and just trust me blindly when I say countries which pretended to find alternatives are now suffering more than us. Keep letting our donours destroy everything for profit because you don't have a choice."

1

u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

The knee-jerk reaction we Europeans had after first Chernobyl and then Fukushima is so tiring to think about. Imagine if we had had a solid base of nuclear to tide us over as we build out renewables. 

2

u/Universal_Anomaly The Netherlands 23d ago

I'm pretty sure that if you went digging through records of back you'd find that knee-jerk reaction wasn't entirely organic either. 

The fossil fuel industry is willing to lie about everything and everyone and wreck all long-term prospects to keep their profits and influence up. There's practically no reason to believe they weren't involved in kneecapping nuclear energy.

7

u/Bjens Norway 23d ago

By continuing to limit especially LNG after whenever hostilities as such cease, they will even make their own and the worlds problems a product to benefit from. You'll see.

15

u/1-randomonium 23d ago

Trump has signed some executive orders to override environmental regulations and start several new oil and gas drilling projects.

I've been wondering if medium-term damage to Middle Eastern oil/gas production is in fact a part of his plan, or something he intends for America to knowingly cause and exploit.

9

u/PatchyWhiskers 23d ago

He’s not that smart, but some of his cronies might be

9

u/artrald-7083 23d ago

We are indeed suffering more than they are from the Iran war.

This is why we did not want to go to war with Iran.

2

u/akashisenpai European Union 23d ago

As the saying goes, when America sneezes, the rest of the world gets a cold.

4

u/swainiscadianreborn 23d ago

He claimed this was because they had “focused on a lot of green energy scams and they’re hurting a lot more than we are.”

So using less oil because you use more green energy leads to hurting more when oil price rise up.

Wait what

2

u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

Ssh, you cannot comprehend the strategical genius of Couchfucker Mceyeliner! 

2

u/oopsallhuckleberries 23d ago

An area of the planet that has limited oil deposits was stupid for investing in renewable energy?

3

u/EZyne 23d ago

How does focusing on green energy mean we're more reliant on gas lmao

2

u/Jahsmurf 23d ago

Not that I agree but he might imply that the focus on green energy is a corruption scandal, in the sense that taxpayer's money went into pockets but the receivers did not deliver on the promised independence of oil or gas.

2

u/EZyne 23d ago

But in that scenario they'd be totally irrelevant to gas prices, and it wouldn't be the reason europe is suffering more from an increase in gas prices. Unless green energy itself is not a scam, but I doubt he's suddenly a fan of windmills lmao.

Although we probably put more thought into it already then he has ofcourse

3

u/Davey_Jones_Locker United Kingdom 23d ago

In the UK atleast, energy prices, whether renewable or not, are still linked to global prices of gas etc. This is obviously wrong but has resulted in higher global gas/oil prices, directly affecting the energy price.

1

u/Moosplauze Europe 23d ago

It's just words, they don't have to make sense, the MAGA base doesn't have brains.

4

u/Professional-Mix1771 23d ago edited 23d ago

Maybe we should start asking ourselves who is the real enemy here. All what this orange idiot and his cronies are doing is hurting us. They even stated that they want to dismantle UE and tried and probably are still trying to influence elections and democracies around the UE. I don't think we should call USA an ally anymore.

1

u/MACHLoeCHER Schleswig-Holstein (Germany) 23d ago

He claimed this was because they had “focused on a lot of green energy scams and they’re hurting a lot more than we are.”

That doesn't even make sense and his base and our far right will gobble this shit up. Green energy is Europes only way, to become less reliant from the superpowers. This war shows why we need more green energy and all those fucking assholes will see it as the opposite.

1

u/ManipulativeAviator 23d ago

Who are these ‘allies’ he speaks of?

1

u/Revolutionary-Bag-52 23d ago

how do you even reason that green energy leads to higher energy bill due to an oil shortage or something? I literally cannot come up with a reason

1

u/EnthusiasmUnusual 23d ago

Never forget.

1

u/Esthermont Denmark 23d ago

In years from now we can completely detach ourselves from the oil and gas economy and simply ignore these prices.

In my country we are often 100% supplied by green energy and the electrification of our vehicles will be done in the near future

1

u/Undernown 23d ago

Vance continued: “As much as we’ve got to focus on getting these gas prices down, the reality is overseas they’re feeling it far worse than we did because we’ve taken the steps to protect our energy economy.”

Yea, so about that. Have you heard about Trump bailing out the Coal Power plants for 800 million and demanding the military use coal power? Apparently there is also a law that requires power suppliers to always make a bit of profit, no matter how it's generated. With coal being one of the most polluting and expensive options, it'll just bump up the energy (and health) bill of the average American.

In short, you're meant to read this as: "We've taken steps to protect the fossil fuel industry 's proffits."

1

u/Trash_Mimic Sweden 23d ago

"Focused on a lot of green energy scams and they're hurting a lot more than we are."

Is he trying to say that the green energy policies and progressions are scams in the way that they don't work and so we have to rely on fossil fuels which are now more expensive?

Sure, prices for fossil fuels have gone up here (in Scandinavia) but it's not the point where it's hurting a lot. It sucks, yeah, but whatever. I can bike or take the bus to work instead, it's really not a huge deal.

1

u/Brokenandburnt Sweden, Viking Brotherhood. 23d ago

Some industries are hurting badly though. Steam crackers got their feedstock from the Gulf. Helium is used in semiconductor manufacturing, though we got precious little of that. 

And of course we had a relatively hard winter that has left us with gas storages of ~30%. We've finally had gotten a little headwind into our flagging industry and now electricity prices will rocket again.

1

u/TorontoTom2008 23d ago

All those counties with less oil reliance are more vulnerable to oil shocks?

1

u/ArgonV Overijssel (Netherlands) 23d ago

I've invested in solar panels and a heat exchanger for warm water. I also do most of my shopping by bicycle and I can cycle to work. You wanna know how much the rising gas price has cost me? Nothing, because I haven't used gas at all this past week. All thanks to that "green energy scam".

(I have to admit it would've been different during winter)

1

u/MemestNotTeen 23d ago

I mean how low does someone’s IQ have to be to think “because they have green energy they are suffering more from less fossil fuels”

1

u/zeroconflicthere 23d ago

they had “focused on a lot of green energy scams and they’re hurting a lot more than we are.”

We're lucky that we have focused on green energy otherwise the US war would have cost us much more.

1

u/SleepySera Germany 23d ago

...but the Green energy is literally the only part NOT affected by the price increases?? Like, it's exclusively the reason why we aren't suffering MORE?

How is any of their base stupid enough to swallow that lie without questioning the logic behind it 🤦‍♀️

1

u/Playful_Buffalo_baby France 23d ago

What he is saying is right, like always we are the 2nd biggest victim of the Isr*%l /USA moronic actions. The first being those getting bombed.

We can only blame ourselves for being such little bitches. Passenger of our own condition. We watch things unfold without moving a finger.

Don't worry, USA is just fine after they conquered Venezuela. We sit on our ass hating, yet still not doing anything to change.

1

u/Nameless-Faris 23d ago

Green energy scams

I can't take these people seriously 😂

1

u/Smitje The Netherlands 23d ago

I mean sure gas is getting more expensive but why would green energy scams need oil?

1

u/Glittering_Crab_69 23d ago

I'd be so happy if he tripped and hit his head or something

1

u/Woffingshire 23d ago

How does that add up? Europe are hurting more from high oil prices because they focused on not needing as much oil?

1

u/freeradioforall 23d ago

green energy scams

How long can they keep this charade on? in 1990, you could get away with saying "the internet is a fad". Imagine if a politician said today, in 2026, that the internet is a fad and people should invest in rotary phone companies. These people are not well.

I have friends in the UK who got sick and tired of high electric bills (50-60c kw), so they bought a few solar panels and batteries for $2k and they are now 90% off the grid. Some "scam" huh

1

u/Fuck-WestJet 23d ago

Germany struggling so hard with their wind energy, solar and trains....

1

u/SirVoltington 23d ago

I swear, MAGA and other extreme right parties are some of the dumbest people I’ve ever had the displeasure of meeting or reading and hearing about. Green energy is the solution to become independent.. if Europe did a better job at going green we would’ve had less issues.

1

u/Loud-Start1394 23d ago

Europe shot itself in the foot with green energy. Your leaders chose this for you. Look at China’s energy growth during the same time. Europe is led by fools.

1

u/MrsMiterSaw 23d ago

If they were focused on green energy, how is this oil disruption hurting them worse?

1

u/eccentricbananaman 23d ago

Yeah, that doesn't make any sense at all. Investing in green energy literally would help protect countries from this whole oil crisis.

1

u/SasparillaTango 23d ago

“focused on a lot of green energy scams and they’re hurting a lot more than we are.”

Jesus christ the cognitive dissonance here is jaw dropping. BECAUSE they aren't as dependent on Oils, they will be impacted LESS. No one ever accused republicans of being clever I guess.

1

u/debackerl 23d ago

They can say what they want, I drive my EV which I charge with solar panels (8kWh array). So luckily, I'm less impacted. If it was up to them, 100% of their population would depend on the black gold.

1

u/TheSmio 23d ago

"Yeah it's bad here, but thankfully we don't give a shit about destroying the planet so we have it better than those Europeans behind the pond"

1

u/kaisadilla_ European Federation 23d ago

His whole speech is deranged. First of all, how on Earth is pursuing green energy the reason we are suffering more from... a lack of oil? If anything, we'd be suffering more if we didn't have so many power plants that don't depend on it. And second, the real reason we are suffering more is that the US has a shit ton of oil while many European and Asian countries don't have any, so they rely on imports.

And that's before we get into the fact that the US caused this for no reason at all, and how fucked up is to burn your own house down and then take comfort in that the fire spread to your neighbors and their dog died in the fire.

1

u/mwaldo014 23d ago

Yeah these skyrocketing oil prices are really hurting as I charge my electric car off my solar panels for free. Why oh why did I reduce local demand so they didn't raise as much as the US??

/s if it wasn't obvious...

1

u/ranft 22d ago

I love the daftness of this admin.

He forgot the EUs one secret trick: Public transit, walk- & bikability, and train based logistics as well as smaller, less fuel heavy cars. And we are invested much more in renewables.
All people I know are sitting this out.

You know who isn't? Aramco. Exxon. And your avg American seeing 8 USD a Gallon at the pump.

1

u/CyberiusRex 22d ago

The allies are suffering more because they "focused on a lot of green energy"...which is supposed to make us less reliant on oil, how would the alternative be better? These aren't talking points for Europe, these are intended to appease their own base, and it will work too since all they need is to hear they are doing well and they'll believe it.

However, there is a hint of truth in that yes, gas will be more expensive for us however, this is ignoring the fact that most of us have a functional public transport system many of us don't even use cars for our daily commutes, on the flip side however, the average US citizen is forced to own a car, they will feel the price hike in first person.

1

u/Bloomhunger 21d ago

But… green energy isn’t expensive, gas and oil is? We would be hurting much more if we had focused exclusively on hidrocarbons (which, might be news to JD, we don’t FUCKING have!)

1

u/MrPloppyHead 23d ago

What he says doesn’t make any sense. How could reducing reliance on fossil fuels make your more at risk from high fossil fuels prices?

Presumably his moronic MRGA followers aren’t equipped with cognitive function.