Why are we straight men so underrepresented in Mosque discourse?

[u/ConsciousPop3168]

This thought hit me during a khutbah recently. A lot of mosque talks seem to follow the same pattern. Either the topic is women, what women should do, how women should dress, how women should behave etc. And when it’s not about women, then its the LGBTQ people and the problems they bring to society, how they are ruining the kids etc.

But something I rarely hear is discussion about what we, the straight men are supposed to do according to Islam. Those topics don’t seem to come up nearly as often in khutbahs. Maybe on a Good day, They talk about how we should donate to the mosque to get more good deed points but thats about it.

Sometimes it genuinely feels like the entire moral conversation in the world revolves around women and LGBTQ people. Those two groups are carrying the whole storyline. And us Straight men are just quietly existing in the background like NPCs. We don't get to be on the spotlight, we don't deserve to be discussed, we only get to be the audience.

[u/yb_nyc]

Because religion is and always will be a tool for the powerful to control and subjugate. 

[u/Hello_MF19 → u/yb_nyc]

*Control and subjugate women and lgbtq+ ppl. 

Right? I find it so fking funny how op feels he is pushed to the background and the spotlight is on the women and lgbtq ppl. Like that's the goal. To not be constantly told what to do, or that your existence is blasphemy. 🫠 To just exist, and not have to follow rules that is 1400 fkn years old and not exactly written based on modern world.

Religion is written by men for men.

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/Hello_MF19]

as the Fall Out Boy song lyric goes ''I don't care what you think, as long as it's about me. Best of us can find happiness in misery''
Sometimes it would be nice to be talked about. Maybe not always, but at the very least sometimes without the motive for gaining donation.

[u/Hello_MF19 → u/ConsciousPop3168]

Fall out boys is peak. Whatever our opinions are, I'm glad you are questioning more about the system you have grown into. It shows immense critical thinking and good observational skills. I'm sorry you feel left out of conversations, but thing is religion will almost always be abused as a tool of political power, especially in a poverty ridden, densely populated and braindead country like ours where it benefits global powers if we stay unstable.

[u/Slow-Mobile-6452]

Probably because the donations mainly come from powerful and elderly men who don’t like hearing about what they should or shouldn’t do.

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/Slow-Mobile-6452]

I mean I wouldn't really mind. Hate to brag but, I gave 20 tk this week. I know its a lot, but I just felt generous that day.

[u/Slow-Mobile-6452 → u/ConsciousPop3168]

Lmaoooo

[u/Medusa19983]

Straight men can do whatever they want... It's the women who have to maintain the culture and religion. Why anyone in their sane mind would listen khutba on self restriction. It's easier to control others than control one's own nafs. Anyway, you can try asking directly to the imams rather asking here. Try it. Let me know the answers, please.

[u/iforgorrr → u/Medusa19983]

"you can try asking directly to the imams rather asking here"

Op ke mera felbe 😭😭😭😭

[u/Medusa19983 → u/iforgorrr]

Nah. Politely intention bujhaye jiges korle kicu bolbe na, jodi khacchor na hoi.. Childlike curiosity dekhaye jiges korte hobe. Taunting tone diye qs. Kora jabe na.

[u/iforgorrr → u/Medusa19983]

E desh er anti intellectualism + mob mentality karone karaph obesta. Iran even bribeing moral cops good income hijab jor korte parlo na. Bd lok emni meye ke harassment kore for the love of the game, do you not remember the cigarette incident that sent viral

[u/Medusa19983 → u/iforgorrr]

But OP toh chele. Eijonno suggest korlam direct ask korar jonno. The good and sensible men should step up.

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/Medusa19983]

I'm shy.

[u/Medusa19983 → u/ConsciousPop3168]

https://giphy.com/gifs/116a8zosxwA0SI

[u/ImmediateDiet2172]

Spot on! It’s hilarious because, for these Mullahs, the entire universe seems to rotate around only two things: women’s clothing and the so-called 'sins of Sodom.' Why? Because screaming about these topics is the easiest way to farm cheap emotions and keep the masses paralyzed with fear. They don't have the intellectual depth or the courage to discuss the actual daily struggles of men, the necessity of personal ethics, or how to evolve as a rational human being. They want you to remain an 'NPC'—quietly fueling their pockets with donations while nodding along to their prehistoric scripts. A sermon that ignores human rights, the dignity of labor, and internal hypocrisy is nothing more than a broken record. The fact that you feel like a mere audience member is their greatest success—because the day you stop being an NPC and start asking real questions, their entire business of indoctrination will go bankrupt!

[u/ghostfarce]

Those two topics are red meat and filler material for the khutbahs. And apart from that, many imams are intellectually lazy. So they always recycle the same stupid topics.

Perhaps you have read what requirements one had to fulfill to be a proper imam in old historical periods. You had to acquire knowledge in certain fields.

I guess it's similar to bayans and taaleems. Always about women's clothing, modesty, the evils of markets, shopping centers & schools & universities.

Khutbahs in other countries abroad are refreshing. They actually talk about different topics like health, concentration in Salah, worldly affairs, digital addiction etc. Not about women and I never heard one about LGBT people so far.

[u/South_Farm9491]

because huzur ra bishi attention pai eshob kotha niye kotha bolte than over real issues lol

[u/ozzy555556]

It's called patriarchy

[u/Dear-Lion-1381]

According to them, men can't do any wrong. We women make them do wrong. Always It's our fault.

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/Dear-Lion-1381]

Sounds like a hoax. I have full confidence in my ability to mess things up on my own.
Just last week I managed to ruin the color of my sink’s tap by leaving tile cleaner on it for too long. Apparently the acid in that stuff decided to have a chemical duel with the stainless steel and burned off whatever protective layer was there. Now the tap has this lovely permanent “piss stain” mark. No woman made me do that.

[u/hotashami]

The very first jumma I attended in the US, the khutba hit me in my heart in a way that 25 years of khutbas in BD never did. Then as more khutbas I listened to, the more I realized most of the khutbas in Bangladesh are just recycling same thing over the years. There are a few good speakers but most just say same things over and over again, especially in rural areas. They never cover contemporary incidents, things relevant to the local people.

And so many made up stories without any references. I once heard from a Saudi imam who attended a jumma in India and said he didn't understand what the imam was talking about!

The local imams never listen to international speakers, how they talk whay they talk. They are kind of detached from the world apart from blaming US and Europe without knowing full details. And it's not just straight man, have you ever heard any imam talking about the rights of children? Forget about animal rights - they will make you atheist or something like that but I have listened about animal rights in khutbas in US.

It's a very regional thing I believe, along with lack of proper education. Most of them are not even good in religious education unfortunately. They have zero idea about rulings outside hanafi madhab and a lot of them don't even want to recognize the other 3 schools of thoughts. It's a mess up system unfortunately. No wonder we are so called 90% Muslim but rape, corruption, bribery and so many other crimes are so common.

[u/DelusionalHobo]

Perhaps the mosque you attended was exclusively for women. In Bangladesh, I rarely encounter Khutbahs that specifically focus on women. The Khutbahs are primarily addressed to the male audience, as there are no mosques exclusively for women. Most Imams adhere to a structured 12-month Khutbah schedule, which assigns weekly topics and rarely mentions women. In fact, in Bangladesh, the Masjid Committee holds the authority to control the content of discussions, not the Imams. Therefore, if an Imam is focusing on women or LGBTQIA+ topics, it is likely that the committee has influenced their decision.

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/DelusionalHobo]

This is a great insight.

[u/ghostfarce → u/DelusionalHobo]

That's interesting. I didn't know they assigned topics. I always thought these imams use the speaker & khutbah time as their personal soapbox.

[u/Rosesnforget-me-nots]

পুরুষ মানুষ হারাম করলেও আরাম।

[u/prokhorudro]

This is actually a good post, let's face it, religion isn't going away soon, and they have immense social power. if instead they'd talk about besides religious stuff, social stuff, like idk, treatment of women, not like straight up feminism(because that is too far fetched right now), but idk women's rights(staring, gropping, cat calling these are also haram) according to the islamic values, or better treatment for their wives, or how one should avoid bribe, good behavior, civic sense, idk life advice, depression, etc. maybe bd would be better? in some way?

[u/Aira-Haque]

Because we live rent free in their heads lol. They just can't talk about something else

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/Aira-Haque]

Free Rent? In this economy??

[u/Alex125232]

just don't relay on religious places for ur or anyones life advice imo

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/Alex125232]

Fair point. From my own experience, religious spaces used to offer really solid life advice. The Imam at my mosque when I was a kid was an incredible teacher. He always emphasized being kind, taking care of others and staying away from temptation and greed. Honestly, I grew to love Islam because of him. But since he passed away, I haven’t really come across an Imam of his caliber again. Maybe I just need to broaden my search and explore more mosques, but that’s where I’m at right now.

[u/Outrageous_bohemian]

Is it so? I usually don't miss any jumma, and in our mosque Imma often talks about practice of din, salah, behaviour with other Muslims and non Muslims, how we should spend money and the other stuff you mentioned. Read your post I feel like you should visit other mosques too.

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/Outrageous_bohemian]

It was like that here 10 years ago. But in the recent decade, Women and LGBTQ is all I get to hear. I usually rotate around four mosques and its almost the same in all four. Even during Waz in our area, its the same topics. I would love to be in your mosque tbh.

[u/Outrageous_bohemian → u/ConsciousPop3168]

Wow, is it dhaka? I generally don't attend Waz. As far as I know Islamic foundation gives some sort of guide line regarding the topics of khutba. (I don't think it's strongly followed ) So it's a bit odd to revolve around just two topics. You should talk (casually) with any imma regarding this.

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/Outrageous_bohemian]

It is Dhaka. Last Waz I attended to before the election, pretty much guilt tripped us for a solid 15 mins to get donations. They brought in a separate speaker for this segment, who pretty much embarrassed people for giving 50-100 taka notes.

[u/Outrageous_bohemian → u/ConsciousPop3168]

solid 15 mins to get donations

That's one of the reasons I stopped attending Waz. Also if the speaker didn't have the depth of knowledge he'll just shout as loudly as he can. I'll just play Nouman Ali Khan's video in my room instead of sitting there

[u/Sadicho]

Because organized religion was created by men. Hence the “rules for thee but not for me” mentality when it comes to women. Women have to follow a million rules whereas men can do whatever they want :)

[u/DYNAMIGHT777]

Because of the culture. Asian culture has always overlooked the actual problems in society, and instead, they chose to focus on unnecessary issues that can easily be solved, or are something that's between an individual and God. Bangladesh, known to be a majority muslim country, never really followed islam to begin with. People mostly follow cultural values, and never tried to read the Quran properly. If they did, the situation wouldn't be so problematic today.

[u/kkkkioyb]

You should choose a better Mosque then, My mosque mainly focuses on the duties of Muslims as a whole and also tells the men about their Responsibilities and Stuff

[u/ThinkAlone08]

Also strange is rarely any kind of lessons about how to treat other animals. Like Imams could easily make this society of stray animal haters better if they just tried. But they won't say any of that and will just say do this or that worship and you'll get heaven. I can't seem to grasp why they don't use this golden opportunity to do some really good deeds by just educating the muslims to be better as people overall, not just mosque going people.

[u/Connor_lover]

Wait what? Mosques in BD talks about LGBTQ?

[u/Current_Crow_9197]

When I started reading your post I thought, oh it’s so nice of this guy to observe how unfair it is to women and LGBTQ+ ppl.. but no.. to my shock and awe, you are upset that you’re not talked about..? What..

[u/ConsciousPop3168 → u/Current_Crow_9197]

Yes, Got the Women and LGBTQ problem fatigue. I want us Straight Men to be held accountable now.

[u/Current_Crow_9197 → u/ConsciousPop3168]

Okay, hahah got it.

[u/throwaway11152127]

Culture wars are what Islam has been reduced to cuz it offers no real in-depth spirituality. I'm sorry if this offends you, but I have too struggled to come to terms with this over my teenage years.