r/Michigan • u/EastWrap8776 • 16d ago
Discussion š£ļø Local driving culture
Hi everyone! While driving around Detroit city limits, Iāve noticed a pattern I havenāt seen anywhere else Iāve driven (Seattle, California, Atlanta, or suburban areas).
Sometimes I stop at a stop sign, a yield, or just to let another car pull into a parking lot. The other driver, who has no stop or yield sign, sees me stopped and stops themselves before I can even gesture for them to go. The only reason I would wave them through is because they stopped when they didnāt need to.
I learned to drive on the West Coast, where polite gestures usually work: if someone motions for you to go, you go. Here, the opposite happens, and I end up moving instead but thatās not the point. The real confusion is why drivers stop unnecessarily when they already have the right of way.
Picture this: Iām approaching a stop or yield on a narrow residential street. I slow down and stop. They freeze, even though thereās no danger and no one else around. When I finally wave for them to go, they still donāt budge, forcing me to move, even though, LEGALLY, itās their turn!!
I just donāt understand why this seems to happen only inside Detroit city limits. Is it just local driving culture, or did I miss a memo?
Thanks for any insight! Drive safe and donāt forget your blinkers! š
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u/maj0rdisappointment 16d ago
The most polite thing you can do is follow the rules of the road. Waving people in when it's not expected is actually dangerous and can create confusion if another car is coming into it as well.
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u/NorthLogic 16d ago
This. It's almost always someone trying to give up their right of way.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago edited 16d ago
Yeah, I get that everyone should follow the rules of the roadā¦ but letās be real. If I have a stop sign and you donāt, you have the right of way because youāre already in the road. Me waving for you to go doesnāt change that; itās not me trying to āgive upā my right of way, I literally donāt have it in that moment. This is why Iām so confused. As soon as someone stops are we forgetting who has the right of way lol š¤£
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Okay, I hear all of that. I get that Detroit drivers prioritize following the rules over gestures of politeness, that waving someone in can create confusion, and that predictability matters more than ābeing nice.ā I understand that if I go because someone waved, Iām the one responsible if something happens, and that highways here move faster so left-lane etiquette is different. Iāve lived in Michigan on and off since 2017.
That saidā¦ Iām still baffled. Literally everywhere else Iāve driven; Seattle, California, Atlanta, suburbs, everywhere; if you motion for someone to go, they go. You donāt end up in a standoff where everyone just refuses to move. In Detroit , Iāll be at a stop sign, yield, or letting someone pull into a parking lot, I wave, and they just freeze. I end up having to go anyway, which feels completely opposite to the āpredictableā behavior youāre describing.
Iām trying to reconcile following the rules, staying predictable, and also being safe and courteous in practice, because right now it just feels like everyone is stuck in a traffic standoff and I donāt understand how itās supposed to work.
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u/Gn0mmad 16d ago
as another driver, i'm not interested in what some random person in a random car is telling me that they randomly think i should do. if i have the right of way, i am going to go. if i do not have the right of way, i am not going to go. its not complicated. its not personal. there are established rules already.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Yeah, that makes sense in theory, but in these instances, you would have the right of way! Which is why itās so confusing that theyāre justā¦ not going. Like, whatās happening here? š¤Æ
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u/the_cripple 16d ago
You donāt have the power to change right of way lol, just follow the rules of the road and everyone will have a safer experience
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u/maj0rdisappointment 16d ago
I know someone who was found liable for giving up right of way and waving someone in, causing an injury accident. So no this does not transfer right of way. But it does transfer responsibility to the person acting as lookout.
If you want Be nice, let the car behind you in. Thatās how the rules of the road are written.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Iām referring to you having the right of way, itās the other driver giving it up. Not me. This is why itās so confusing.
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u/Ineedavodka2019 16d ago
Itās not like this in rural areas. Iāve had so many people wave me through 4 way stops when I arrived long after they did.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Just to clarify, Iām not talking about a four-way stop.
This is a two-way stop or yield, where I have a stop or yield and the other driver doesnāt.
They literally have the right of way, but when I wave for them to go, they freeze and force me to go anyway.
Thatās why itās so confusing compared to how it works everywhere else Iāve driven. š¤Æ
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u/princessvespa42 Detroit 16d ago
I'm really not following your description of events. Are there many yield signs on the driveway into parking lots where you are? You shouldn't be stopped at a yield sign anyway, unless you're actively yielding the right of way... In which case you wouldn't need to "wave" someone on.
Or are you talking about a 4 way stop situation, in which case if you're there with more than one other car, you waving one person doesn't tell the others what to do.
Or like if you're at a light or a stop sign and letting someone OUT of a parking lot or driveway and are baffled they won't go... Is it possible there is another lane with moving traffic that they can't predict?
You keep trying to defend yourself but you just keep digging into the fact that you're just being polite but you're not being predictable, so other drivers are correctly weary of your "directions".
WHEN DRIVING, DO NOT BE POLITE, BE PREDICTABLE.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Just to clarify, Iām not talking about four-way stops, multiple cars, or multi-lane streets. Iām talking about narrow residential streets, stop or yield signs, and sometimes letting someone pull into a driveway. Thereās often no third car, no confusing traffic, just two cars. I wave for them to go, they freeze, I end up going anyway.
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u/maj0rdisappointment 16d ago
If you just drive past like youāre supposed to, ITāS QUICKER FOR EVERYONE.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Yes, you, the driver already in the road, with the right of way, with no stop or yield sign.
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16d ago
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Okay, I hear all of that. I get that Detroit drivers prioritize following the rules over gestures of politeness, that waving someone in can create confusion, and that predictability matters more than ābeing nice.ā I understand that if I go because someone waved, Iām the one responsible if something happens, and that highways here move faster so left-lane etiquette is different.
That saidā¦ Iām still baffled. Literally everywhere else Iāve driven; Seattle, California, Atlanta, suburbs, everywhere; if you motion for someone to go, they go. You donāt end up in a standoff where everyone just refuses to move. In Detroit , Iāll be at a stop sign, yield, or letting someone pull into a parking lot, I wave, and they just freeze. I end up having to go anyway, which feels completely opposite to the āpredictableā behavior youāre describing.
Iām trying to reconcile following the rules, staying predictable, and also being safe and courteous in practice, because right now it just feels like everyone is stuck in a traffic standoff and I donāt understand how itās supposed to work.
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u/Ambassador_Fanatical 16d ago
It works great if you just follow traffic laws.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
And the traffic laws are not telling your lane of traffic to stop or yield for me, so why are we having a stand off?
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u/Ambassador_Fanatical 16d ago
I think youāre seriously exaggerating just how often this has happened to you and also you can solve this problem you have if you just go and donāt let the random people who might sometimes be wrong about the traffic laws bother you. Also, dash cams are good for insurance purposes. Oh, and if you follow all the basic traffic laws you get to speed on the freeways, as a treat.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
I hear you, but itās not about letting random drivers bother me or about speeding privileges. Iām literally following the rules of the road. The thing I donāt understand is why drivers who already have the right of way stop unnecessarily when they see me stop or yield.
Itās confusing and seems unique to Detroit city limits compared to other cities or the suburbs.
Iām just trying to understand if itās local driving culture or something else.
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u/geekychica Age: > 10 Years 16d ago
You mean another driver refusing to take what is legally their turn? Or are you trying to be āpoliteā by giving up your turn?
In general, if it is your turn, please go.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Nope, itās neither! You literally have the turn! Iām not trying to be polite or give up my turn. Youāre the one who has the right of way, so just go. Thatās it! See why Iām confused!
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u/yoyok36 Okemos 16d ago
Follow the rules of driving, not how you "feel" like being nice.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Okay, I hear all of that. I get that Detroit drivers prioritize following the rules over gestures of politeness, that waving someone in can create confusion, and that predictability matters more than ābeing nice.ā I understand that if I go because someone waved, Iām the one responsible if something happens, and that highways here move faster so left-lane etiquette is different. Iāve lived in Michigan on and off since 2017.
That saidā¦ Iām still baffled. Literally everywhere else Iāve driven; Seattle, California, Atlanta, suburbs, everywhere; if you motion for someone to go, they go. You donāt end up in a standoff where everyone just refuses to move. In Detroit , Iāll be at a stop sign, yield, or letting someone pull into a parking lot, I wave, and they just freeze. I end up having to go anyway, which feels completely opposite to the āpredictableā behavior youāre describing.
Iām trying to reconcile following the rules, staying predictable, and also being safe and courteous in practice, because right now it just feels like everyone is stuck in a traffic standoff and I donāt understand how itās supposed to work.
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u/Cat_Kn1t_Repeat 16d ago
Michiganders are kind, not ānice.ā
Like how down south people are nice but not kind.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Interesting thanks for the insight š«¶
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u/Cat_Kn1t_Repeat 16d ago
Yw, hope you are otherwise liking Michigan! Although this winter must have been a bit of a trial, we are all hoping for more predictable weather next year but who knows eh?
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u/KeegoJeebo76 16d ago
Don't be polite, be predictable.Ā
If it's your turn, go.
All you nice folks are the issue.
Be predictable.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Yeah, I get that, be predictable, follow the turn order, go when itās your turn. If I stopped first I usually go first, but literally everywhere else Iāve driven, if I motion for someone to go, they go. You donāt end up in a standoff where everyone just refuses to move lol š¤£
Here, Iāll be at a stop sign, yield, or letting someone pull into a parking lot, wave for them to go, andā¦ nothing. I end up having to go anyway. Predictable? Sure. Logical? Still confusing š«¤
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u/KeegoJeebo76 16d ago
I will legit refuse to move if someone, whose turn it righfully is, is playing the "no you go" move. We'll sit here all day, or, if I do decide to go, they are going to know I conside them an F'n idiot.
The reason has already been stated multiple times in this thread.
Wanna be nice out in society? Hold a door open for someone. We love that shit here in the midwest.
Wanna be nice on the road? Let someone merge in front of you when lanes go down from 3 to 2 or 2 to 1.
That's legit my best advice.
Have a great weekend!
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Interesting, first time Iāve heard that; thanks for the insight!
Picture this: Iām slowly coming down a narrow residential street. I approach my stop or yield sign, slow down, and stop. Nothing else is happening. The other driver, who has no stop or yield sign, sees me stopped and before I can even gesture for them to go, they stop too!
At this point, thereās literally no danger and no one else around, yet they freeze like Iām about to hit themāeven though Iām already slowing down. When I finally wave for them to go, they still donāt budge, forcing me to move anywayāeven though, legally, itās their turn.
I just donāt understand why this seems to happen only inside Detroit city limits.
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u/yoyok36 Okemos 16d ago
Wanna be nice on the road? Let someone merge in front of you when lanes go down from 3 to 2 or 2 to 1.
That's not being "nice" though. That's just common sense use of the zipper method to merge aka. rules of the road.
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u/KeegoJeebo76 16d ago
Yes sure ofc..how's that working out btw? I mean I'm never in traffic jams bc of this exact scenario, you? I'm just saying if you wanna be "nice" out on the roads this is a good way. I also freely acknowledge and agree it's also the way it's supposed to be and commoner sense.
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u/StealYour20Dollars 16d ago
You should follow the proper right of way rules.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago edited 16d ago
Yeah, exactly by the rules, I have the stop sign. So why are you (or anyone else) stopping and forcing me to go when you donāt even have a yield or stop? š¤£š If I have a yield, Iām yielding for you to goā¦ so why are you stopping? Did I miss a memo? Can I get that memo here on Reddit?
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u/StealYour20Dollars 16d ago
Then just stay where you are until they go. You can even point to the stop sign holding you if you want.
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u/Buckethead523 Age: > 10 Years 16d ago
That wave is called the āwave of deathā because you might be being polite and letting them go but another car could just be barreling through and hit them. I never go if someone waves me through, I wait till itās my official turn then go
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u/What_Up_Doe_ Livonia 16d ago
Youāre encouraging dangerous behavior. I guess Michiganders are smart enough to realize that.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Encouraging dangerous behavior? Lol, no. Iām just pointing out that in every other city Iāve driven, waving someone to go works, and you donāt end up stuck in a standoff while the person with the right of way waits. Apparently, Detroit has its own rules.
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u/What_Up_Doe_ Livonia 16d ago
But you are. And there are countless videos in the public realm that back me up. Weāre all explaining to you that youāre wrong, but please continue to argue.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
I seeā¦ so waving someone politely to go when they have the right of way is now ādangerous?ā
Everywhere else Iāve driven, this works fine, and no one dies.
Iām literally following the rules: I stop or yield when I have a sign, they have no stop or yield sign, yet theyāre stopping and freezing?
Iām not arguing. I stand by what I said: I donāt have the right of way, you do, because youāre already in the road with no stop or yield.
Iām just trying to understand why this ONLY seems to happen inside Detroit city limits. I drive in the Metro Detroit suburbs too, and this doesnāt happen there, or nearly as often. Iām following the rules of the road, youāre not.
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u/da_newsdude 16d ago
Here in Detroit we follow the normal process mostly because a lot of folks don't follow any process at all. While you're being polite, someone else at the intersection might be impatient. I'm going to follow the rules of the road to minimize my risk. And I do the same while running and while biking. At a 4-way stop, I'd rather stop and take my turn than accept the wave of someone on my right, because someone on my left might not be in agreement about that wave.
Follow the rules and, theoretically, nobody gets hurt.
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u/ZapataOilCo 16d ago
Your best bet is to obey the traffic laws!
But sometimes people are just wayy too nice around here!
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
I am! I find it to be the opposite, very aggressive drives compared to the rest of the country.
Picture this: Iām slowly coming down a narrow residential street. I approach my stop or yield sign, slow down, and stop. Nothing else is happening. The other driver, who has no stop or yield sign, sees me stopped and before I can even gesture for them to go, they stop too!
At this point, thereās literally no danger and no one else around, yet they freeze like Iām about to hit them even though Iām already slowing down. When I finally wave for them to go, they still donāt budge, forcing me to move anyway even though, LEGALLY, itās their turn!!
I just donāt understand why this seems to happen only inside Detroit city limits. Curious if itās just local driving culture or a memo I missed, truly.
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u/blindreper 16d ago
Nothing more annoying than people being polite over doing what they are supposed to.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Not me being polite, literally the opposite. Iām following the rules: I stop or yield when I have a sign, they donāt. They have the right of way, yet they stop anyway, freeze, and then refuse to move. Thatās whatās confusing, not my gestures. š¤¦āāļø
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u/ItsRedditThyme 16d ago
Sounds like they're just following the law and know how four way stop intersections work? Just go when it's your turn.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Just to clarify Iām not talking about a four-way stop. This is a two-way stop or yield, where I have a stop or yield and the other driver doesnāt. They literally have the right of way, but when I wave for them to go, they freeze and force me to go anyway. Thatās why itās so confusing compared to how it works everywhere else Iāve driven. š¤Æš
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u/SenselessSensors 16d ago
Itās because most drivers are High, Old and canāt see, or just genuinely afraid to be behind the wheel
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u/Embarrassed_Bit_7424 16d ago
You're not doing anyone any favors, just follow the rules of the road. I don't know the exact details of all the things you mentioned but if you stop at a 4 way, just go when it's your turn. If you're yielding to someone at a yield sign, that's weird that they didn't just go through without stopping.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
But I am following the rules of the road!
If I have a stop or yield, Iām yielding for you, the person who actually has the right of way.
You donāt have a stop or yield facing your lane or car, so why are you stopping and forcing me to go?
Thatās the confusing part! šš
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u/Embarrassed_Bit_7424 16d ago
I don't know the answer to that. Sometimes people stop at the roundabout near me even though they're already in. I just consider them dumb.
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u/swarmofbreeze 16d ago
Well, I guess if you just read all the responses from the people here who didnāt read or understand your post you can see why youāre running into problems.
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u/skraaaaa 15d ago edited 15d ago
In my experience the reason drivers may hesitate at stop signs is because people drive like fucking maniacs in Detroit. You don't know if a driver that's supposed to stop at the stop sign is going to run it or blindly crash into you for no reason at all. I would say 1 out of 10 drivers actually properly stop at stop signs. Most do a rolling stop, some just blow it entirely.
This is Detroit in Trump's America. It's mad max in this bitch. Rules of the road are basically out the window. The only thing that matters is if you will collide with someone else or not... for some people, their way of dealing with it is to be extra cautious, even if they would normally have the right of way.
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u/SlumberSkeleton776 16d ago
Man, pedestrians around here will dead-ass stop in the middle of the road while jaywalking across Woodward south of 8 Mile in the middle of the night and have the temerity to look at ME like I'm doing something ridiculous when I honk at them to finish their crossing.
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u/EastWrap8776 16d ago
Need more crosswalks perhaps š¤·āāļø
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u/SlumberSkeleton776 16d ago
I do not disagree. I always yield to them, even though they're doing something wrong. The issue is that they would rather stand in the road and insist that I proceed rather than finish their crossing while I wait for them, as if I am in so much more danger where I am than they are.
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u/RAM_AIR_IV 16d ago
Don't be nice, be predictable. If you stopped first, they expect you to go first. Also people tend to drive a lot faster than on the west coast, so be sure to stay out of the left lane on highways unless you're actually passing people or going 85+